• Re: THE $10 MILLION PRIZE FOR PROOF EVOLUTION 2.0

    From Richmond@21:1/5 to Ron Dean on Tue Mar 19 17:06:55 2024
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came about from the
    group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to erik simpson on Tue Mar 19 17:33:19 2024
    erik simpson <[email protected]> writes:

    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to
    identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came about from the
    group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great
    Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/
    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this. This isn't new;
    it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier. There's even a book: https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    That page appears to have the answer, DNA is a code. DNA is naturally
    occuring. I claim my $10 million dollars. I'd like it paid in
    gold.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Athel Cornish-Bowden@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Tue Mar 19 18:58:05 2024
    On 2024-03-19 17:42:43 +0000, John Harshman said:

    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019,
    at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't the
    genetic code an example therof?

    Not to mention several others described by Marcello Barbieri in his
    book The Organic Codes.


    --
    athel cb : Biochemical Evolution, Garland Science, 2016

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Tue Mar 19 18:42:41 2024
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019,
    at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't the
    genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to Richmond on Tue Mar 19 18:29:49 2024
    On 19/03/2024 17:33, Richmond wrote:
    erik simpson <[email protected]> writes:

    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>> identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came about from the
    group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/
    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this. This isn't new;
    it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier. There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802 >>
    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    That page appears to have the answer, DNA is a code. DNA is naturally occuring. I claim my $10 million dollars. I'd like it paid in
    gold.


    Ron Dean conflated abiogenesis and evolution. The challenge is to cause
    the equivalent of the genetic code to spontaneously form in real time.
    You can't point to the evolution of SARS-COV-2 in real time to win the
    prize, but that doesn't mean that the evolution of SARS-COV-2 isn't part
    of the reality of nature. (Alternatively, stellar evolution is part of
    the reality of nature, but that doesn't mean that one can reasonably
    expect to form a star in the laboratory.)

    Ron Dean also misrepresented the criterion for winning. As stated
    previously, the challenge is not to identify a code, but to cause one to
    form spontaneously in real time.

    Ron Dean may have provided the wrong link. If my memory serves me
    correctly there's a creationist "prize" on superficially similar lines.

    A couple of other comments. I wondered what would happen if someone
    submitted ChatGPT as a contender for the prize, but reading the finer
    print, the requirement is for a chemical process. Spiegelman's monster
    is a chemical, and similar structures form spontaneously from systems of nucleotides and a RNA-dependent RNA polymerase, but I guess that doesn't qualify as a code. Other out of the box ideas are index minerals and
    Fraunhofer lines in stellar spectra (but the latter works on the atomic,
    rather than the molecular level).

    This also reminds me of Kaufmann's self-organisation research program,
    which I have the impression gave better results in relation to ecology
    that to abiogenesis.

    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Tue Mar 19 18:49:48 2024
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:33, Richmond wrote:
    erik simpson <[email protected]> writes:

    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000
    PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group
    formed to identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came
    about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The
    Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/ What do you mean by code? Like a dress
    code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this. This isn't
    new; it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier. There's even a
    book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured. That page
    appears to have the answer, DNA is a code. DNA is naturally
    occuring. I claim my $10 million dollars. I'd like it paid in gold.


    Ron Dean conflated abiogenesis and evolution. The challenge is to
    cause the equivalent of the genetic code to spontaneously form in real
    time. You can't point to the evolution of SARS-COV-2 in real time to
    win the prize, but that doesn't mean that the evolution of SARS-COV-2
    isn't part of the reality of nature. (Alternatively, stellar evolution
    is part of the reality of nature, but that doesn't mean that one can reasonably expect to form a star in the laboratory.)

    Ron Dean also misrepresented the criterion for winning. As stated
    previously, the challenge is not to identify a code, but to cause one
    to form spontaneously in real time.

    Ron Dean may have provided the wrong link. If my memory serves me
    correctly there's a creationist "prize" on superficially similar
    lines.

    A couple of other comments. I wondered what would happen if someone
    submitted ChatGPT as a contender for the prize, but reading the finer
    print, the requirement is for a chemical process. Spiegelman's monster
    is a chemical, and similar structures form spontaneously from systems
    of nucleotides and a RNA-dependent RNA polymerase, but I guess that
    doesn't qualify as a code. Other out of the box ideas are index
    minerals and Fraunhofer lines in stellar spectra (but the latter works
    on the atomic, rather than the molecular level).

    This also reminds me of Kaufmann's self-organisation research program,
    which I have the impression gave better results in relation to ecology
    that to abiogenesis.

    Well that all sounds great. I suppose the next question I had lined up:
    what do you mean by 'nature', would be superfluous.

    What about the courtship dances of birds, are they a code? or the
    patterns of colour in their plumage? or the song of the blackbird, or
    the robin...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Tue Mar 19 18:55:55 2024
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring
    code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    Bird song is a naturally occuring code, and I could cause it to
    spontanously form by removing the elastic band from the bird's beak
    which I had previously placed there. I claim my £10,000,000 (or
    $10,000.000) prize again.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DB Cates@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Tue Mar 19 14:06:41 2024
    On 2024-03-19 1:42 PM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019,
    at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't the
    genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    "cause...spontaneously"? Somehow I don't think anyone will ever win that
    prize.
    --
    --
    Don Cates ("he's a cunning rascal" PN)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DB Cates@21:1/5 to Richmond on Tue Mar 19 14:09:57 2024
    On 2024-03-19 1:55 PM, Richmond wrote:
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring
    code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    Bird song is a naturally occuring code, and I could cause it to
    spontanously form by removing the elastic band from the bird's beak
    which I had previously placed there. I claim my £10,000,000 (or
    $10,000.000) prize again.

    But if you "caused" it, it ain't "spontaneous". {:p
    --
    --
    Don Cates ("he's a cunning rascal" PN)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to DB Cates on Tue Mar 19 19:20:15 2024
    DB Cates <[email protected]> writes:

    On 2024-03-19 1:55 PM, Richmond wrote:
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring
    code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.
    Bird song is a naturally occuring code, and I could cause it to
    spontanously form by removing the elastic band from the bird's beak
    which I had previously placed there. I claim my £10,000,000 (or
    $10,000.000) prize again.

    But if you "caused" it, it ain't "spontaneous". {:p

    I set up the laboratory conditions which allowed it to spontaneously
    form. :>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DB Cates@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Tue Mar 19 15:44:10 2024
    On 2024-03-19 3:28 PM, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 11:42 AM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code. >>>> The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't the
    genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    But if you cause it, it isn't spontaneous.

    There you go. *Proof* that i"m just one of John's innumerable sock puppets.
    --
    --
    Don Cates ("he's a cunning rascal" PN)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Tue Mar 19 20:50:55 2024
    On 19/03/2024 20:26, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 11:29 AM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:33, Richmond wrote:
    erik simpson <[email protected]> writes:

    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group
    formed to
    identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/
    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't new; >>>> it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    That page appears to have the answer, DNA is a code. DNA is naturally
    occuring. I claim my $10 million dollars. I'd like it paid in
    gold.


    Ron Dean conflated abiogenesis and evolution. The challenge is to
    cause the equivalent of the genetic code to spontaneously form in real
    time. You can't point to the evolution of SARS-COV-2 in real time to
    win the prize, but that doesn't mean that the evolution of SARS-COV-2
    isn't part of the reality of nature. (Alternatively, stellar evolution
    is part of the reality of nature, but that doesn't mean that one can
    reasonably expect to form a star in the laboratory.)

    Ron Dean also misrepresented the criterion for winning. As stated
    previously, the challenge is not to identify a code, but to cause one
    to form spontaneously in real time.

    Now there's an oxymoron.

    For a parallel, you can cause crystals to form spontaneously - dissolve
    in hot water, and allow to cool slowly.


    Ron Dean may have provided the wrong link. If my memory serves me
    correctly there's a creationist "prize" on superficially similar lines.

    A couple of other comments. I wondered what would happen if someone
    submitted ChatGPT as a contender for the prize, but reading the finer
    print, the requirement is for a chemical process. Spiegelman's monster
    is a chemical, and similar structures form spontaneously from systems
    of nucleotides and a RNA-dependent RNA polymerase, but I guess that
    doesn't qualify as a code. Other out of the box ideas are index
    minerals and Fraunhofer lines in stellar spectra (but the latter works
    on the atomic, rather than the molecular level).

    This also reminds me of Kaufmann's self-organisation research program,
    which I have the impression gave better results in relation to ecology
    that to abiogenesis.



    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to Richmond on Tue Mar 19 21:08:56 2024
    On 19/03/2024 20:54, Richmond wrote:
    Is there anything which has no cause?

    According to our best understanding of the universe ...

    Radioactive decay at a particular instance in time. Photon emission from
    an atom at a particular instance in time. Production of one product
    rather than another when a molecule is excited in a photochemical reaction.

    Basically the timing and path of the decay of an excited quantum system
    is only statistically predictable - there is a cause for it to decay,
    but not for it to decay at a particular time, or in a particular way.

    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to DB Cates on Tue Mar 19 20:54:45 2024
    DB Cates <[email protected]> writes:

    On 2024-03-19 3:28 PM, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 11:42 AM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a
    private equity investment group formed to identify a naturally
    occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's
    for causing one to spontaneously form.

    But if you cause it, it isn't spontaneous.

    There you go. *Proof* that i"m just one of John's innumerable sock puppets.

    Is there anything which has no cause?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From RonO@21:1/5 to Richmond on Tue Mar 19 17:14:24 2024
    On 3/19/2024 12:33 PM, Richmond wrote:
    erik simpson <[email protected]> writes:

    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>> identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came about from the
    group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/
    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this. This isn't new;
    it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier. There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802 >>
    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    That page appears to have the answer, DNA is a code. DNA is naturally occuring. I claim my $10 million dollars. I'd like it paid in
    gold.


    You not only have to generate an encoder like DNA, but you have to have
    a decoder that does something with the encoded signal. You need the DNA
    or RNA coded sequence, a mRNA that transmits the code, and a reader that decodes the message.

    It is a pretty unfair challenge because you need a lot of money just to
    fund the research to try to produce the parts. What they should do is
    break the prize into multiple parts. You can submit your scenario and
    win research funds to actually try it out, and if you are successful you
    get the full prize.

    Ron Okimoto

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to erik simpson on Wed Mar 20 08:09:15 2024
    On 20/03/2024 03:36, erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>>> identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't
    new; it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of Great
    Britain?

    Zero.

    What is puzzling me is why it is referred to as the Royal Society of
    Great Britain. It's the The Royal Society of London for Improving
    Natural Knowledge, commonly referred to as the Royal Society. (To
    disambiguate from the Royal Societies of Edinburgh and New Zealand one
    would normally refer to it as the Royal Society of London.)

    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Athel Cornish-Bowden@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Wed Mar 20 09:47:28 2024
    On 2024-03-20 08:09:15 +0000, Ernest Major said:

    On 20/03/2024 03:36, erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>>>> identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't new; >>>> it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of Great Britain?

    Zero.

    What is puzzling me is why it is referred to as the Royal Society of
    Great Britain. It's the The Royal Society of London for Improving
    Natural Knowledge, commonly referred to as the Royal Society. (To disambiguate from the Royal Societies of Edinburgh and New Zealand one
    would normally refer to it as the Royal Society of London.)

    Come on. This is Ron Dean, what do you expect?


    --
    athel cb : Biochemical Evolution, Garland Science, 2016

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to Ron Dean on Wed Mar 20 08:14:06 2024
    On 20/03/2024 02:55, Ron Dean wrote:
    Richmond wrote:
    DB Cates <[email protected]> writes:

    On 2024-03-19 1:55 PM, Richmond wrote:
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private >>>>>>> equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring >>>>>>> code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, >>>>>>> 2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for >>>>> causing one to spontaneously form.
    Bird song is a naturally occuring code, and I could cause it to
    spontanously form by removing the elastic band from the bird's beak
    which I had previously placed there. I claim my £10,000,000 (or
    $10,000.000) prize again.

    But if you "caused" it, it ain't "spontaneous". {:p

    I set up the laboratory conditions which allowed it to spontaneously
    form. :>

    Please explain exactly where in the wording in the site where the prize depends on spontaneously forming. The genetic code exist, There can be
    no life and no evolution without genetic information.

    If you read proceed a little further into the site, you find that
    criterion for winning the prize to be

    "You must arrange for a digital communication system to emerge or
    self-evolve without "cheating." The diagram below describes the system.
    Without explicitly designing the system, your experiment must generate
    an encoder that sends digital code to a decoder. Your system needs to
    transmit at least five bits of information. (In other words it has to be
    able to represent 32 states. The genetic code supports 64.) "


    As everyone knows, the information in the parents genetics is passed
    from parents to offspring, that expresses for body shape, parts, organs,
    - that work together in harmony, eye color, hair color etc.etc.etc.
    This, requires highly complex information. The prize in my opinion (for
    what it's worth) is in regards the the origin of the DNA-RNA and the
    source of the information contained. It's a issue I've raised before.
    "If the present is the key to the past", then at the present time highly complex information comes _only_ from mind. Show that how the DNA/RNA
    and the complex information contained is derived through and from
    natural processes.I _personally_believe_ this is the basis for the
    prize.  The human brain is considered the most complex object on the planet.  This brain should be equipped to resolve this issue and win the prize.


    A counter-challenge for you. Create a star in a laboratory.

    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Athel Cornish-Bowden@21:1/5 to erik simpson on Wed Mar 20 09:46:26 2024
    On 2024-03-20 03:36:48 +0000, erik simpson said:

    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>>> identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't new;
    it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of Great Britain?

    Zero.

    George Church, likewise. Denis Noble is a distinguished physiologist,
    but his views on evolution are, shall we say, a bit special. Michael
    Ruse seemed to be sensible when he wrote Darwinism Defended, but he's
    gone a bit over the rails since he moved to Florida.


    --
    athel cb : Biochemical Evolution, Garland Science, 2016

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From G@21:1/5 to JTEM on Wed Mar 20 09:54:29 2024
    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's
    prize for "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as
    impossible to force a payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.

    G

    [snip the rest]

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to Ron Dean on Wed Mar 20 09:45:10 2024
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    Richmond wrote:
    DB Cates <[email protected]> writes:

    On 2024-03-19 1:55 PM, Richmond wrote:
    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000
    PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group
    formed to identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came
    about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The
    Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's
    for causing one to spontaneously form. >>>> Bird song is a
    naturally occuring code, and I could cause it to >>>> spontanously
    form by removing the elastic band from the bird's beak >>>> which
    I had previously placed there. I claim my £10,000,000 (or >>>>
    $10,000.000) prize again.

    But if you "caused" it, it ain't "spontaneous". {:p I set up the
    laboratory conditions which allowed it to spontaneously form. :>

    Please explain exactly where in the wording in the site where the
    prize depends on spontaneously forming. The genetic code exist, There
    can be no life and no evolution without genetic information.

    As everyone knows, the information in the parents genetics is passed
    from parents to offspring, that expresses for body shape, parts,
    organs, - that work together in harmony, eye color, hair color
    etc.etc.etc. This, requires highly complex information. The prize in
    my opinion (for what it's worth) is in regards the the origin of the
    DNA-RNA and the source of the information contained. It's a issue I've
    raised before. "If the present is the key to the past", then at the
    present time highly complex information comes _only_ from mind. Show
    that how the DNA/RNA and the complex information contained is derived
    through and from natural processes.I _personally_believe_ this is the
    basis for the prize. The human brain is considered the most complex
    object on the planet. This brain should be equipped to resolve this
    issue and win the prize.

    The oldest DNA discovered is 2 million years old and is from rodents,
    reindeer and geese, and mastodon. As there were no humans in Artica at
    that time it must have been created naturally. Perhaps you should
    explain what you mean by 'naturally'?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-63867164

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to Ron Dean on Wed Mar 20 10:04:24 2024
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for >>>>> causing one to spontaneously form.

    Please explain exactly where in the wording in the site where the
    prize depends on spontaneously forming. The genetic code exist, There
    can be no life and no evolution without genetic information.

    I was responding to Ernest Major. I haven't even visited the site as I
    am not in the habit of clicking on links willy-nilly.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Wed Mar 20 10:06:39 2024
    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's prize for
    "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as impossible to force a
    payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to
    demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.


    How do you know? Can you prove it?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Athel Cornish-Bowden@21:1/5 to Richmond on Wed Mar 20 11:40:41 2024
    On 2024-03-20 10:04:24 +0000, Richmond said:

    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for >>>>>> causing one to spontaneously form.

    Please explain exactly where in the wording in the site where the
    prize depends on spontaneously forming. The genetic code exist, There
    can be no life and no evolution without genetic information.

    I was responding to Ernest Major. I haven't even visited the site as I
    am not in the habit of clicking on links willy-nilly.

    I made that mistake this morning. I clicked on a plausible-looking link
    in Wikipedia and found myself on a pornography site, from which it
    proved very difficult to escape.

    --
    athel cb : Biochemical Evolution, Garland Science, 2016

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Burkhard@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Wed Mar 20 11:14:23 2024
    John Harshman wrote:

    On 3/19/24 1:54 PM, Richmond wrote:
    DB Cates <[email protected]> writes:

    On 2024-03-19 3:28 PM, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 11:42 AM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR
    SOMEONE _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a
    private equity investment group formed to identify a naturally
    occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, >>>>>>> 2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't
    the genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's
    for causing one to spontaneously form.

    But if you cause it, it isn't spontaneous.

    There you go. *Proof* that i"m just one of John's innumerable sock puppets. >>
    Is there anything which has no cause?

    James Dean?

    There are other things that used to have
    a cause, but not any longer - cf "Lost cause"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ernest Major@21:1/5 to Athel Cornish-Bowden on Wed Mar 20 12:43:18 2024
    On 20/03/2024 08:47, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
    On 2024-03-20 08:09:15 +0000, Ernest Major said:

    On 20/03/2024 03:36, erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group
    formed to
    identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of >>>>>>> Great
    Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't
    new; it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book: >>>>> https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of
    Great Britain?

    Zero.

    What is puzzling me is why it is referred to as the Royal Society of
    Great Britain. It's the The Royal Society of London for Improving
    Natural Knowledge, commonly referred to as the Royal Society. (To
    disambiguate from the Royal Societies of Edinburgh and New Zealand one
    would normally refer to it as the Royal Society of London.)

    Come on. This is Ron Dean, what do you expect?


    In this instance he was quoting from the web site. I think I have to
    infer that George Church, Denis Noble and Michael Ruse didn't have much
    input on the content of the web site. Can we blame Perry Marshall, or
    was it delegated to a minion.
    --
    alias Ernest Major

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pro Plyd@21:1/5 to Richmond on Wed Mar 20 09:16:54 2024
    Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE. THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to
    identify a naturally occurring code. The Prize came about from the
    group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great
    Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    Yes. No blue genes allowed.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pro Plyd@21:1/5 to Ron Dean on Wed Mar 20 09:16:33 2024
    Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code.
    The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    What? No Ed Conrad?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pro Plyd@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Wed Mar 20 09:33:27 2024
    Ernest Major wrote:
    On 20/03/2024 03:36, erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:


    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of
    Great Britain?

    Zero.

    What is puzzling me is why it is referred to as the Royal Society of
    Great Britain. It's the The Royal Society of London for Improving
    Natural Knowledge, commonly referred to as the Royal Society. (To disambiguate from the Royal Societies of Edinburgh and New Zealand one
    would normally refer to it as the Royal Society of London.)

    There used to be a term "Royal Society of Great Britain"
    as such which goes back to the 1700s or earlier. Looks
    like there are different names all referring to the same thing.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pro Plyd@21:1/5 to John Harshman on Wed Mar 20 09:19:25 2024
    John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 11:42 AM, Ernest Major wrote:
    On 19/03/2024 17:42, John Harshman wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:01 AM, Ron Dean wrote:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE.

    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE
    _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS:
    Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million technology prize backed by a private
    equity investment group formed to identify a naturally occurring code. >>>> The Prize came about from the group’s inaugural meeting May 31,
    2019, at The Royal Society of Great Britain.

    The judges are:
    George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    How would you recognize a naturally occurring code? And why isn't the
    genetic code an example therof?


    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for
    causing one to spontaneously form.

    But if you cause it, it isn't spontaneous.


    "Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes
    in a puff of logic.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Casanova@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 20 09:27:08 2024
    On Wed, 20 Mar 2024 10:06:39 +0000, the following appeared
    in talk.origins, posted by Richmond <[email protected]>:

    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's prize for
    "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as impossible to force a
    payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to
    demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.


    How do you know? Can you prove it?

    That's a bit disingenuous. Can you prove there's no
    invisible, impalpable elephant in your front yard?

    Rationally, "proving" the nonexistence of something which
    has never been demonstrated to exist is trivial; simply
    point to the lack of evidence of its existence, and invite
    the claimant of existence to show you are wrong by providing
    such evidence.

    --

    Bob C.

    "The most exciting phrase to hear in science,
    the one that heralds new discoveries, is not
    'Eureka!' but 'That's funny...'"

    - Isaac Asimov

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Bob Casanova@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 20 09:34:27 2024
    On Wed, 20 Mar 2024 11:40:41 +0100, the following appeared
    in talk.origins, posted by Athel Cornish-Bowden
    <[email protected]>:

    On 2024-03-20 10:04:24 +0000, Richmond said:

    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    Ernest Major <{$to$}@meden.demon.co.uk> writes:

    The prize isn't for identifying a naturally occurring code. It's for >>>>>>> causing one to spontaneously form.

    Please explain exactly where in the wording in the site where the
    prize depends on spontaneously forming. The genetic code exist, There
    can be no life and no evolution without genetic information.

    I was responding to Ernest Major. I haven't even visited the site as I
    am not in the habit of clicking on links willy-nilly.

    I made that mistake this morning. I clicked on a plausible-looking link
    in Wikipedia and found myself on a pornography site, from which it
    proved very difficult to escape.

    Closing the browser, or worst case doing a hard reset or
    power cycle, usually works. A bit of a PITA, granted...

    --

    Bob C.

    "The most exciting phrase to hear in science,
    the one that heralds new discoveries, is not
    'Eureka!' but 'That's funny...'"

    - Isaac Asimov

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Casanova@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 20 09:32:00 2024
    On Wed, 20 Mar 2024 08:55:05 -0700, the following appeared
    in talk.origins, posted by erik simpson
    <[email protected]>:

    On 3/20/24 1:46 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
    On 2024-03-20 03:36:48 +0000, erik simpson said:

    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.� THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group
    formed to
    identify a naturally occurring code.� The Prize came about from the >>>>>>> group�s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.� This isn't
    new; it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.� There's even a book: >>>>> https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the� 3 judges or the Royal Society of
    Great Britain?

    Zero.

    George Church, likewise. Denis Noble is a distinguished physiologist,
    but his views on evolution are, shall we say, a bit special. Michael
    Ruse seemed to be sensible when he wrote Darwinism Defended, but he's
    gone a bit over the rails since he moved to Florida.


    Florida has that effect on many. Except for historical context, I find
    the words "Darwinism" or "Darwinist" to be red flags.

    "Evolutionism" and "evolutionist" are right up there, too;
    they all imply that this particular branch of science is
    actually a religion.

    --

    Bob C.

    "The most exciting phrase to hear in science,
    the one that heralds new discoveries, is not
    'Eureka!' but 'That's funny...'"

    - Isaac Asimov

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Athel Cornish-Bowden@21:1/5 to erik simpson on Wed Mar 20 18:13:46 2024
    On 2024-03-20 15:55:05 +0000, erik simpson said:

    On 3/20/24 1:46 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
    On 2024-03-20 03:36:48 +0000, erik simpson said:

    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>>>>> identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't new; >>>>> it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book:
    https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of Great Britain?

    Zero.

    George Church, likewise. Denis Noble is a distinguished physiologist,
    but his views on evolution are, shall we say, a bit special. Michael
    Ruse seemed to be sensible when he wrote Darwinism Defended, but he's
    gone a bit over the rails since he moved to Florida.


    Florida has that effect on many. Except for historical context, I find
    the words "Darwinism" or "Darwinist" to be red flags.

    Yes, but he was British when he wrote it, and in the UK "Darwinism" has
    never been a dirty word. I think Richard Dawkins calls himself a
    Darwinist.


    --
    Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 37 years; mainly
    in England until 1987.

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  • From G@21:1/5 to Richmond on Wed Mar 20 18:44:29 2024
    Richmond <[email protected]> wrote:
    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's prize for
    "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as impossible to force a
    payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to
    demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.


    How do you know? Can you prove it?

    Of course. Can you prove that the proof that no paranormal or psychic powers exist does not exists?
    If not that should mean that it exists, at least according to your way of thinking, and that should be enough to satisfy you.

    G

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  • From Richmond@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Wed Mar 20 19:49:36 2024
    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    Richmond <[email protected]> wrote:
    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's prize for
    "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as impossible to force a
    payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to
    demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.


    How do you know? Can you prove it?

    Of course. Can you prove that the proof that no paranormal or psychic powers exist does not exists?

    No.

    If not that should mean that it exists, at least according to your way of thinking, and that should be enough to satisfy you.


    I don't know whether such powers exist. It seems unlikely. But quantum entanglement seems unlikely, and yet there it is.

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  • From Burkhard@21:1/5 to Ernest Major on Wed Mar 20 23:27:58 2024
    Ernest Major wrote:

    On 20/03/2024 03:36, erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 5:25 PM, Ron Dean wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:
    On 3/19/24 10:06 AM, Richmond wrote:
    Ron Dean <[email protected]> writes:

    THIS IS A GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME WEALTHY. A $10,000.000 PRIZE. >>>>>>
    IF EVOLUTION IS A REALITY OF NATURE.  THERE IS NO REASON FOR SOMEONE >>>>>> _NOT_ TO WIN THIS PRIZE.

    EVOLUTION 2.0 PRIZE KEY FACTS: Evolution 2.0 is a $10 million
    technology prize backed by a private equity investment group formed to >>>>>> identify a naturally occurring code.  The Prize came about from the >>>>>> group’s inaugural meeting May 31, 2019, at The Royal Society of Great >>>>>> Britain.

    The judges are: George Church. Denis Noble, Michael Ruse

    https://evo2.org/theprize/

    What do you mean by code? Like a dress code?

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.  This isn't
    new; it's been around since 2006, maybe earlier.  There's even a book: >>>> https://www.amazon.com/Evolution-2-0-Breaking-Deadlock-Between/dp/1940363802

    The usual "atheists vs. ID proponents" are featured.

    What do you know about the the  3 judges or the Royal Society of Great
    Britain?

    Zero.

    What is puzzling me is why it is referred to as the Royal Society of
    Great Britain. It's the The Royal Society of London for Improving
    Natural Knowledge, commonly referred to as the Royal Society. (To disambiguate from the Royal Societies of Edinburgh and New Zealand one
    would normally refer to it as the Royal Society of London.)

    Maybe that's a different society. One that's......Invisible

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  • From Bob Casanova@21:1/5 to All on Fri Mar 22 10:14:46 2024
    On Wed, 20 Mar 2024 09:27:08 -0700, the following appeared
    in talk.origins, posted by Bob Casanova <[email protected]>:

    On Wed, 20 Mar 2024 10:06:39 +0000, the following appeared
    in talk.origins, posted by Richmond <[email protected]>:

    G <[email protected]d> writes:

    JTEM <[email protected]> wrote:
    erik simpson wrote:

    I have sneaking suspicion nobody's going to win this.

    Now close the circle: It's as worthless as Randi's prize for
    "Proving" the paranormal. It's equally as impossible to force a
    payout.


    Of course it was impossible to win Randi's prize, you had to
    demonstrate psychic or paranormal powers, and no such thing exists.


    How do you know? Can you prove it?

    That's a bit disingenuous. Can you prove there's no
    invisible, impalpable elephant in your front yard?

    Rationally, "proving" the nonexistence of something which
    has never been demonstrated to exist is trivial; simply
    point to the lack of evidence of its existence, and invite
    the claimant of existence to show you are wrong by providing
    such evidence.

    <crickets>

    No real surprise.

    --

    Bob C.

    "The most exciting phrase to hear in science,
    the one that heralds new discoveries, is not
    'Eureka!' but 'That's funny...'"

    - Isaac Asimov

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