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  • Re: How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly me

    From Mikko@21:1/5 to olcott on Tue May 13 10:41:21 2025
    On 2025-05-12 18:17:37 +0000, olcott said:

    Introduction to the Theory of Computation 3rd Edition
    by Michael Sipser (Author)
    4.4 out of 5 stars 568 rating

    https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Theory-Computation-Michael-Sipser/dp/113318779X


    int DD()
    {
    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
    if (Halt_Status)
    HERE: goto HERE;
    return Halt_Status;
    }

    DD correctly simulated by any pure simulator
    named HHH cannot possibly terminate thus proving
    that this criteria has been met:

    <MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
    If simulating halt decider H correctly simulates its
    input D until H correctly determines that its simulated D
    would never stop running unless aborted then

    This specifies two requirements:
    1. H correctly simulates that part of the behaviour of D that starts
    from the start of the execution and does not end before the second
    requirement is satisfied.
    2. H correctly determines that unsimulated part of the behaviour is
    infinitely long.

    The second reuirement is not satisfied when HHH analyses the above
    DD.

    --
    Mikko

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  • From Mikko@21:1/5 to olcott on Sun May 18 13:40:32 2025
    On 2025-05-13 13:54:15 +0000, olcott said:

    On 5/13/2025 2:41 AM, Mikko wrote:
    On 2025-05-12 18:17:37 +0000, olcott said:

    Introduction to the Theory of Computation 3rd Edition
    by Michael Sipser (Author)
    4.4 out of 5 stars    568 rating

    https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Theory-Computation-Michael-Sipser/
    dp/113318779X

    int DD()
      {
       int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
       if (Halt_Status)
         HERE: goto HERE;
       return Halt_Status;
      }

    DD correctly simulated by any pure simulator
    named HHH cannot possibly terminate thus proving
    that this criteria has been met:

    <MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
         If simulating halt decider H correctly simulates its
         input D until H correctly determines that its simulated D
         would never stop running unless aborted then

    This specifies two requirements:
    1. H correctly simulates that part of the behaviour of D that starts
    from the start of the execution and does not end before the second
    requirement is satisfied.
    2. H correctly determines that unsimulated part of the behaviour is
    infinitely long.

    The second reuirement is not satisfied when HHH analyses the above
    DD.

    In other words you believe that DD will halt
    on its own without ever being aborted by HHH.
    That is counter-factual.

    I didn't say so. If HHH does not return zero then DD does not halt.
    I said that your HHH, unlike some other partial halt deciders, fails
    to analyze DD enough to correctly determine whether it halts.

    _DD()
    [00002133] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping
    [00002134] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping
    [00002136] 51 push ecx ; make space for local
    [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD
    [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD)
    ...

    HHH determines that DD correctly simulated by
    HHH keeps calling HHH(DD)

    which in reality does not happen as DD calls HHH only once.

    --
    Mikko

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