• NEW Logic versus OLD Logic (Re: Was Poincare crushed by the New)

    From Mild Shock@21:1/5 to Mild Shock on Mon Jan 6 10:02:31 2025
    Hi,

    Poincare gives an interesting insight, mostly forgotten,
    that the last 100 years brought us a new logic:

    Science and method
    by Poincaré, Henri, 1854-1912 https://archive.org/details/sciencemethod00poinuoft/page/n3/mode/2up

    His struggle starts at page 160, The New Logics.
    Similar Einstein was New Mechanics for him.

    So what are NEW and OLD logic:

    - NEW Logic: The Logic for the Past Atom Age
    The new logic is basically a logic that allows to
    formalize the real numbers, for example via set theory.
    It was judged so important that the whole education
    underwent a transformation:

    One of the motives was the Sputnik shock, as a result
    of which there was a great need to catch up
    educationally in the West.
    https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neue_Mathematik

    - OLD Logic: The Logic for the Coming Artificial Age
    The old logic is basically Aristotelian Begriffslogik.
    Bis zum 19. Jahrhundert war es die dominante Tradition.
    Die Logiker für eine solche Logik waren mehr Grammatiker
    und Wissensimgenieure, und weniger Mathematiker die der
    Physik zugedient haben.

    https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begriffslogik

    LLMs give a new spin on OLD Logic, which has sent
    shockwaves into hardcore NEW Logic proponents
    as a means for Begriffslogik. Especially the use of
    of less formal means based on natural language itself,

    which was somehow seen as a problem, could be a solution:

    Modern ontologies:
    • Philosophers have debated the foundations for centuries.
    • They emphasize technical terms defined in logic.
    • But people talk. write. and think in natural languages (NLs).
    • Any distinctions not represented in NLs tend to be ignored.

    The Great Debate between John Sowa and Barry Smith https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhYaTW5MK_U

    Bye

    Mild Shock schrieb:

    Poincare had quite some problems with the
    formal revolution that took place as well
    in the last 100 or more years, starting with

    things like naive set theory and its antinomies,
    ending with computer formalized proofs of the Keppler
    packing nowadays. He wrote a lengthy book:

    Science and method
    by Poincaré, Henri, 1854-1912 https://archive.org/details/sciencemethod00poinuoft/page/n3/mode/2up

    His struggle starts at page 160, The New Logics.
    Similar Einstein was New Mechanics for him.
    Mostlikely Poincaré nowadays would be a form of

    Sabine Hossenfelder with 100 YouTube videos and
    possibly many followers. Poincaré faced the
    destiny of any old fart that became irrelevant

    over the time and turned into a commentator.

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