• Pushing my Luck

    From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to All on Fri Feb 11 15:43:36 2022
    When I setup my shop I never figured it would be so full. It was just
    supposed to be a warehouse for my contracting business. I never planned
    on it being a machine shop or that I would actually learn to weld more
    than some thin to medium gage mild steel.

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place. I tried a
    couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.
    Sadly I only ever put in one 50 amp outlet in the shop near the back
    door. I recognized this as a problem some time back and bought a 50ft
    50 amp cord. That allowed me to weld in about 75% of the shop. More
    than enough I thought. Then this boat came in. No way to pull it
    inside. A buddy of mine loaned me his 50 ft welding extension cord.
    Between the two of them I could reach everywhere I needed to reach, and
    blew out all those screws in short order. Its not pretty, but it worked
    and it was fast.

    I doubt I'll need to do that very often, but I ordered another 50ft
    welding extension cord just in case. I'm sure I won't be able to use
    the full power of my MIG welder on 100 ft of 8/3, but I was wondering
    how far I could push it. The Paige online size wire calculator says I
    should be able to draw 40 amps from the wall. I'm not sure what that
    means in practical real world welding, but its got to be better than
    dragging the 120V flux core out front to tack something up so I can
    safely drag it in the back to weld it out.

    Maybe someday I'll spring for 100ft of 6/3 for a welder extension cord
    and be able to pull the full 50 amps from the wall outlet, but this will
    have to do for now.

    P.S. A spot weld cutter actually worked, but it took way to long. If I
    just had a couple I'd have probably done it that way, but I had to
    remove 44 screws from boat ribs.

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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Fri Feb 11 18:54:30 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su6oqn$ee3$[email protected]...

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place. I tried a
    couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.

    ----------------------

    I take it you left big smokin' holes rather than salvagable threads in the aluminum.

    On old cars and small engines I usually have to replace the rusted screw
    with a new one.

    Could be worse, I met a man who was rebuilding a Rolls-Royce Nene jet engine with a large, closely spaced circle of small corroded screws in aluminum.

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Fri Feb 11 17:32:33 2022
    On 2/11/2022 4:54 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:su6oqn$ee3$[email protected]...

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place.  I tried a couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.

    ----------------------

    I take it you left big smokin' holes rather than salvagable threads in
    the aluminum.

    On old cars and small engines I usually have to replace the rusted screw
    with a new one.

    Could be worse, I met a man who was rebuilding a Rolls-Royce Nene jet
    engine with a large, closely spaced circle of small corroded screws in aluminum.



    Yep. I'll flap wheel it flat, and use rivets to reattach the sole when
    I am ready. In the short term during fitup of everything I'll use
    stainless steel screws. The screws will get pulled and replaced with
    rivets when everything is right.

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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Sat Feb 12 07:07:17 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su6v70$llq$[email protected]...

    On 2/11/2022 4:54 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su6oqn$ee3$[email protected]...

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place. I tried a
    couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.

    ----------------------

    I take it you left big smokin' holes rather than salvagable threads in the aluminum.

    On old cars and small engines I usually have to replace the rusted screw
    with a new one.

    Could be worse, I met a man who was rebuilding a Rolls-Royce Nene jet
    engine with a large, closely spaced circle of small corroded screws in aluminum.



    Yep. I'll flap wheel it flat, and use rivets to reattach the sole when
    I am ready. In the short term during fitup of everything I'll use
    stainless steel screws. The screws will get pulled and replaced with
    rivets when everything is right.

    -----------------------

    In case you or others don't know, #5 screws have a diameter of 1/8" and are good temporary assembly substitutes for 1/8" rivets if you don't have or the space is too tight for Clecos. #10 screws work for 3/16" rivets.

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Sat Feb 12 10:17:53 2022
    On 2/12/2022 5:07 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:su6v70$llq$[email protected]...

    On 2/11/2022 4:54 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:su6oqn$ee3$[email protected]...

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place.  I tried a
    couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.

    ----------------------

    I take it you left big smokin' holes rather than salvagable threads in
    the aluminum.

    On old cars and small engines I usually have to replace the rusted
    screw with a new one.

    Could be worse, I met a man who was rebuilding a Rolls-Royce Nene jet
    engine with a large, closely spaced circle of small corroded screws in
    aluminum.



    Yep.  I'll flap wheel it flat, and use rivets to reattach the sole when
    I am ready.  In the short term during fitup of everything I'll use
    stainless steel screws.  The screws will get pulled and replaced with
    rivets when everything is right.

    -----------------------

    In case you or others don't know, #5 screws have a diameter of 1/8" and
    are good temporary assembly substitutes for 1/8" rivets if you don't
    have or the space is too tight for Clecos. #10 screws work for 3/16"
    rivets.



    Talk about lucky. I have a couple boxes of #10 wide head (not sure if
    they are called washer head or truss head) stainless sheet metal screws
    and several bags of 3/16 closed end wide head pop rivets for the blind
    holes. For accessible through hull stuff (other parts of the project) I
    have 3/16 and 1/4 solid rivets. Just haven't decided what to use for a
    sealant under the solid rivet heads yet.

    I'm leaning towards DAP tub and tile clear. For machine enclosures and
    in the past for outdoor surface mounted junction and equipment boxes it
    has done a better job over time than all but the most expensive marine
    sealants and is much easier to work with. Because it finishes clear
    squeeze out is unnoticeable in most applications. If I do have a rivet
    leak or two it will be in the older rivets I didn't remove anyway. Even
    then it wouldn't be anything that would kick a bilge pump on more than
    once in a day. Probably not even that often. The guy who gave (sold
    cheap) me the boat used to camp out in it for days at a time. All the
    new stuff is above the waterline anyway. Yes its a very off label
    application. Its rated for indoor use, but I never had a problem with
    it when used between surfaces.

    I will need to weld a few things before I am done, but that can all wait
    for now. I'll be able to return my buddy's cord long before then
    because my own extra cord will be arriving this week. I thought about
    making a 6x3 cord of my own, but that is some seriously expensive wire.
    Paige wire calculator says I can run a full 50 amps over 100ft of 6x3.
    Its just more than I want to spend. If I really need to do a lot of
    heaver welding up front I'll just cover/abandon the outlet box in the
    back and install one directly below the main sub panel for the shop.
    That is much closer to the front of the building, but a 50ft cord would
    still reach the back door with room to work. That would be much cheaper
    than a 100ft 6x3 cord.



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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 12 18:56:35 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su8q43$4j1$[email protected]...

    ...If I do have a rivet
    leak or two it will be in the older rivets I didn't remove anyway. ...

    ------------------

    Just hammer them tighter.

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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 12 19:38:40 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su8q43$4j1$[email protected]...

    I'm leaning towards DAP tub and tile clear. For machine enclosures and
    in the past for outdoor surface mounted junction and equipment boxes it
    has done a better job over time than all but the most expensive marine
    sealants and is much easier to work with.
    ------------------------

    Thanks for the advice. I've generally had poor luck with sealants used
    outdoors in sunlight, except for a Silicone (brand??) in the joint between aluminum siding and aluminum window trim covering which has remained intact
    for ~15 years.

    I used those washer/truss head screws to fasten down corrugated panels on a roof extension because the flanged hex heads meant for them snag the snow
    rake. Sealing washers punched from red rubber sheet from HD deteriorated at
    the edges from sunlight. Inner tube rubber is worse.

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Sun Feb 13 08:50:00 2022
    On 2/12/2022 5:38 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:su8q43$4j1$[email protected]...

    I'm leaning towards DAP tub and tile clear.  For machine enclosures and
    in the past for outdoor surface mounted junction and equipment boxes it
    has done a better job over time than all but the most expensive marine sealants and is much easier to work with.
    ------------------------

    Thanks for the advice. I've generally had poor luck with sealants used outdoors in sunlight, except for a Silicone (brand??) in the joint
    between aluminum siding and aluminum window trim covering which has
    remained intact for ~15 years.

    I used those washer/truss head screws to fasten down corrugated panels
    on a roof extension because the flanged hex heads meant for them snag
    the snow rake. Sealing washers punched from red rubber sheet from HD deteriorated at the edges from sunlight. Inner tube rubber is worse.



    Not sure what you might use it for, but it comes out of the tube
    "thinner" than most other sealants I have used. Makes sense since it
    comes in a squeeze tube.

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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Sun Feb 13 16:05:22 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:sub9b9$g2a$[email protected]...

    On 2/12/2022 5:38 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:su8q43$4j1$[email protected]...

    I'm leaning towards DAP tub and tile clear. ...

    ------------------------------

    Not sure what you might use it for, but it comes out of the tube
    "thinner" than most other sealants I have used. Makes sense since it
    comes in a squeeze tube.

    ----------------------------

    Outdoor lights and cameras, TV antenna and solar panel wiring, sealing car
    rust repairs, ...

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Sun Feb 13 16:02:46 2022
    On 2/13/2022 2:05 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:sub9b9$g2a$[email protected]...

    On 2/12/2022 5:38 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:su8q43$4j1$[email protected]...

    I'm leaning towards DAP tub and tile clear.  ...

    ------------------------------

    Not sure what you might use it for, but it comes out of the tube
    "thinner" than most other sealants I have used. Makes sense since it
    comes in a squeeze tube.

    ----------------------------

    Outdoor lights and cameras, TV antenna and solar panel wiring, sealing
    car rust repairs, ...


    Should be right up that alley. I don't know how well it weathers
    extreme cold. We usually only get a couple nights a year that drop
    below freezing just before sunrise. Some years we don't get any.


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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Mon Feb 14 08:01:14 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:suc2ml$abl$[email protected]...

    Should be right up that alley. I don't know how well it weathers
    extreme cold. We usually only get a couple nights a year that drop
    below freezing just before sunrise. Some years we don't get any.

    ------------------

    Thanks, that's a good thing to test. Tonight's low is predicted to be 0F, or
    I could put a sample in the freezer to see if it becomes brittle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass_transition

    The manual for my Alpicool freezer claims it can be set as low as -40 C/F.
    When vaccines were near release I mentioned the 20 liter model to several medical professionals as a possible vaccine freezer that operates from a 12V vehicle battery and carries as easily as a picnic cooler. My larger 60 liter one transports like wheeled luggage. I set it up to automatically use solar, else grid, else battery power and it's costing less than $1.50 per month to run.

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Bob La Londe on Thu Feb 17 12:11:42 2022
    On 2/11/2022 3:43 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
    When I setup my shop I never figured it would be so full.  It was just supposed to be a warehouse for my contracting business.  I never planned
    on it being a machine shop or that I would actually learn to weld more
    than some thin to medium gage mild steel.

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place.  I tried a couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter. Sadly
    I only ever put in one 50 amp outlet in the shop near the back door.  I recognized this as a problem some time back and bought a 50ft 50 amp
    cord.  That allowed me to weld in about 75% of the shop.  More than
    enough I thought.  Then this boat came in.  No way to pull it inside.  A buddy of mine loaned me his 50 ft welding extension cord. Between the
    two of them I could reach everywhere I needed to reach, and blew out all those screws in short order.  Its not pretty, but it worked and it was
    fast.

    I doubt I'll need to do that very often, but I ordered another 50ft
    welding extension cord just in case.  I'm sure I won't be able to use
    the full power of my MIG welder on 100 ft of 8/3, but I was wondering
    how far I could push it.  The Paige online size wire calculator says I should be able to draw 40 amps from the wall.  I'm not sure what that
    means in practical real world welding, but its got to be better than
    dragging the 120V flux core out front to tack something up so I can
    safely drag it in the back to weld it out.

    Maybe someday I'll spring for 100ft of 6/3 for a welder extension cord
    and be able to pull the full 50 amps from the wall outlet, but this will
    have to do for now.

    P.S.  A spot weld cutter actually worked, but it took way to long.  If I just had a couple I'd have probably done it that way, but I had to
    remove 44 screws from boat ribs.



    Well, I now have 100 feet of 8/3 welder extension cord. I can now reach
    well out past the 20' concrete apron on the front of my shop. I may no
    longer have a need for the little 120V ProCore MIG. Gonna keep it
    anyway. I would have liked 6/3, but its was out of my budget.


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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Bob La Londe on Thu Feb 17 12:12:25 2022
    On 2/17/2022 12:11 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
    On 2/11/2022 3:43 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
    When I setup my shop I never figured it would be so full.  It was just
    supposed to be a warehouse for my contracting business.  I never
    planned on it being a machine shop or that I would actually learn to
    weld more than some thin to medium gage mild steel.

    The other day I needed to blow some steel screws out of some aluminum
    boat ribs because they were rusted off and seized in place.  I tried a
    couple different toothed cutters before trying the plasma cutter.
    Sadly I only ever put in one 50 amp outlet in the shop near the back
    door.  I recognized this as a problem some time back and bought a 50ft
    50 amp cord.  That allowed me to weld in about 75% of the shop.  More
    than enough I thought.  Then this boat came in.  No way to pull it
    inside.  A buddy of mine loaned me his 50 ft welding extension cord.
    Between the two of them I could reach everywhere I needed to reach,
    and blew out all those screws in short order.  Its not pretty, but it
    worked and it was fast.

    I doubt I'll need to do that very often, but I ordered another 50ft
    welding extension cord just in case.  I'm sure I won't be able to use
    the full power of my MIG welder on 100 ft of 8/3, but I was wondering
    how far I could push it.  The Paige online size wire calculator says I
    should be able to draw 40 amps from the wall.  I'm not sure what that
    means in practical real world welding, but its got to be better than
    dragging the 120V flux core out front to tack something up so I can
    safely drag it in the back to weld it out.

    Maybe someday I'll spring for 100ft of 6/3 for a welder extension cord
    and be able to pull the full 50 amps from the wall outlet, but this
    will have to do for now.

    P.S.  A spot weld cutter actually worked, but it took way to long.  If
    I just had a couple I'd have probably done it that way, but I had to
    remove 44 screws from boat ribs.



    Well, I now have 100 feet of 8/3 welder extension cord.  I can now reach well out past the 20' concrete apron on the front of my shop.  I may no longer have a need for the little 120V ProCore MIG.  Gonna keep it anyway.   I would have liked 6/3, but its was out of my budget.




    Of course now I need to cleanup the shop so I can actually roll the
    welding carts out front. LOL.

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  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 08:12:53 2022
    "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:sum6mp$etf$[email protected]...

    Of course now I need to cleanup the shop so I can actually roll the
    welding carts out front. LOL.

    ---------------

    Bulldozer blade on the front?

    One of the specs GM required for custom factory equipment was that it be forklift-proofed, meaning that internal wiring was in grounded metal conduit
    so the operator wouldn't get a shock if they drove the forks into it. Rather than bend EMT to fit tight spots we used a lot of Sealtite, which also met
    the hose down spec. I've seen less well waterproofed wiring on a submarine.

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  • From Bob La Londe@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Tue Feb 22 14:21:29 2022
    On 2/22/2022 6:12 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:sum6mp$etf$[email protected]...

    Of course now I need to cleanup the shop so I can actually roll the
    welding carts out front.  LOL.

    ---------------

    Bulldozer blade on the front?

    One of the specs GM required for custom factory equipment was that it be forklift-proofed, meaning that internal wiring was in grounded metal
    conduit so the operator wouldn't get a shock if they drove the forks
    into it. Rather than bend EMT to fit tight spots we used a lot of
    Sealtite, which also met the hose down spec. I've seen less well
    waterproofed wiring on a submarine.

    Honestly, probably yes. Drive the tractor through with the front loader
    down.

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