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  • Why so many fossil apes in Europe?

    From Paul Crowley@21:1/5 to All on Fri Jul 8 13:17:01 2022
    Why so many fossil apes in Europe -- in
    contrast to the scarcity of fossil apes
    elsewhere, especially in Africa. . . ?

    Or to ask the question in a different way:
    Why did the bodies of African apes rarely
    finish up in rivers or lakes, while those of
    European ones often did. . ?

    I suggest that the ancestors of those
    getting to Europe around 16 ma were
    obliged to lose lost their fear of water.
    There were plenty of shallow seas and
    lakes in the final stages of the closing
    of the Tethys sea around 16 ma (the
    Mesopotamian Seaway closure). A
    readiness to cross rivers was an
    important factor in the dispersal of a
    new taxon (arriving from the East) into
    and around Europe.

    The ape branch that went south into Africa
    did not face the same pressures and never
    lost its fear of water.

    An important factor is that European apes
    occupied deciduous forest. So the resource
    availability would have had great seasonal
    variability. Each band or group probably had
    extensive ranges and had to move to lower
    altitudes in winter; journeys that would
    often have involved crossing rivers.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hominid_dispersals_in_Europe
    In the early Miocene, Europe had a subtropical climate and was intermittently connected to Africa by land bridges. At the same time, Africa was becoming more arid, prompting the dispersal of its tropical fauna—including primates—north into Europe.[6]
    Apes first appear in the European fossil record 17 million years ago with Griphopithecus.[7] The closely related Kenyapithecus is also known from fossils in Germany, Slovakia and Turkey.[6] Both Griphopithecus and Kenyapithecus are considered likely to
    be ancestral to the great apes.[8] From 13 million to 9 million years ago, hominids flourished in Europe and underwent an adaptive radiation as they diversified in response to a gradually cooling climate.[6][9] Middle Miocene European hominids include
    Pierolapithecus, Anoiapithecus, Dryopithecus, Hispanopithecus, and Rudapithecus.[5] The diversity and early appearance of great apes in Europe has led some scientists to theorise that hominids in fact evolved there, before dispersing "back to Africa" in
    the Middle Miocene.

    Also good video -- When Apes Conquered Europe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzRzUmrHL7c

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    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_l@21:1/5 to Paul Crowley on Sat Jul 9 07:34:42 2022
    On Friday, July 8, 2022 at 4:17:02 PM UTC-4, Paul Crowley wrote:
    Why so many fossil apes in Europe -- in
    contrast to the scarcity of fossil apes
    elsewhere, especially in Africa. . . ?

    Or to ask the question in a different way:
    Why did the bodies of African apes rarely
    finish up in rivers or lakes, while those of
    European ones often did. . ?

    I suggest that the ancestors of those
    getting to Europe around 16 ma were
    obliged to lose lost their fear of water.
    There were plenty of shallow seas and
    lakes in the final stages of the closing
    of the Tethys sea around 16 ma (the
    Mesopotamian Seaway closure). A
    readiness to cross rivers was an
    important factor in the dispersal of a
    new taxon (arriving from the East) into
    and around Europe.

    The ape branch that went south into Africa
    did not face the same pressures and never
    lost its fear of water.

    An important factor is that European apes
    occupied deciduous forest. So the resource
    availability would have had great seasonal
    variability. Each band or group probably had
    extensive ranges and had to move to lower
    altitudes in winter; journeys that would
    often have involved crossing rivers.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hominid_dispersals_in_Europe
    In the early Miocene, Europe had a subtropical climate and was intermittently connected to Africa by land bridges. At the same time, Africa was becoming more arid, prompting the dispersal of its tropical fauna—including primates—north into Europe.[
    6] Apes first appear in the European fossil record 17 million years ago with Griphopithecus.[7] The closely related Kenyapithecus is also known from fossils in Germany, Slovakia and Turkey.[6] Both Griphopithecus and Kenyapithecus are considered likely
    to be ancestral to the great apes.[8] From 13 million to 9 million years ago, hominids flourished in Europe and underwent an adaptive radiation as they diversified in response to a gradually cooling climate.[6][9] Middle Miocene European hominids include
    Pierolapithecus, Anoiapithecus, Dryopithecus, Hispanopithecus, and Rudapithecus.[5] The diversity and early appearance of great apes in Europe has led some scientists to theorise that hominids in fact evolved there, before dispersing "back to Africa" in
    the Middle Miocene.

    Also good video -- When Apes Conquered Europe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzRzUmrHL7c

    Not really Europe, but the Black Sea region and sometimes the Mediterranean and Rift valley and Bavaria along the Danube.

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  • From I Envy JTEM@21:1/5 to Paul Crowley on Sat Jul 9 22:11:54 2022
    Paul Crowley wrote:

    Why so many fossil apes in Europe

    Oh, come on, the queen's not THAT old!




    -- --

    https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/689056492842844160

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