On 2.3.2024 23.42, Sawfish wrote:

On 3/2/24 11:20 AM, PeteWasLucky wrote:

Do you believe there is a God or a creator/s?

No so that I can tell. So looks like not.

If you believe there is a God or Creator, does this belief influence
you to live your life in specific way? If yes, how?

If you don't believe there is a God, don't you feel that what we live
is too random, empty, and purposeless? If no, then how do you feel?

Like when I watch relatively predatory animals on a TV documentary. I
see myself as a lot like a coyote, or another social  canine.

I see you as a hare.

--
"And off they went, from here to there,
The bear, the bear, and the maiden fair"
-- Traditional

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 3/2/2024 1:20 PM, PeteWasLucky wrote:

Do you believe there is a God or a creator/s?

If you believe there is a God or Creator, does this belief influence you to live your life in specific way? If yes, how?

If you don't believe there is a God, don't you feel that what we live is too random, empty, and purposeless? If no, then how do you feel?

This discussion is meant to be respectable discussion without personal attacks on other beliefs.

Ice and Skriptis, chill please.

Just a few thoughts from me, perhaps I will expand more later. Perhaps not:

I was born and raised Catholic. But by the time I was 18 I was already questioning if there is a GOD that watches my everyday behavior/actions.
At that point I stopped going to church.

Historically it is almost impossible to prove that Jesus Christ walked
the earth. Here is an example: http://www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/jesus_myth_history.htm

I think all religions are good if they make one feel better about
themselves. Of course, many folks will use this to improve their own
wallets, which is disgusting to those they take advantage of.

I also think humans are the worst "virus" the planet Earth has ever
seen. I remember watching this during the first Matrix movie and I
thought it was *so spot on*. How many animals kill other animals simply
for fun? How many other animals kill animals so it will starve other animals/humans into submission? How many other animals create machines/bullets/holes for other humans to die in? The list goes on.

Ultimately, I hope there is a GOD *and* a Satan. And I hope they relish punishing those who were bastards on Earth and got away with it.
--
---------------
Scall5

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 3/03/2024 6:20 am, PeteWasLucky wrote:

Do you believe there is a God or a creator/s?

God no, 'creator/s' also no in a religious sense. Depends how broadly
we want to describe 'creator'.

If you believe there is a God or Creator, does this belief influence you to live your life in specific way? If yes, how?

If you don't believe there is a God, don't you feel that what we live is too random,

Life couldn't be more random lol. Your odds of being here are 1 in 400 trillion. That means you are more likely to win the lottery 1 million
times than being born. That's about as close to zero chance of being
born as we can possibly contemplate.

empty, and purposeless? If no, then how do you feel?

I feel amazing. I'm fully aware I am extremely fortunate to not only be
born but to live in Australia and ridiculously privileged to be in top
1%. I can do what I want every day, go anywhere in the world if I want,
and buy anything I want - within reason lol, I don't aspire to own
football teams etc : ).

My 'purpose' is to just live my life and try not to hurt others along
the way, indeed make others a bit happier if it doesn't take too much
effort. I realize life is short and that puts everything in perspective
for me. I have no fear of death as it's just a state of non existence,
like the period before I was born. I wasn't stressed/anxious 200 yrs
ago, 1,000 yrs ago, so I won't be stressed after I die. Stressing,
being anxious about death etc is a complete waste of time as you can't influence anything, when your number is up that's it. You won't miss
life as you'll be dead, only living beings can miss something. It's
only a big deal if you let it be a big deal - it's really as simple as
that. Also if you reach really advanced years I imagine death will be a
sweet release of sorts.

I feel very fortunate to also be in great health, get to play tennis 3
times a week all year around, go to gym/swim/yoga regularly, occasional
golf. The wife and I go to concerts and shows every 2 or 3 weeks, I
attend soccer and rugby games every week with 'the boys', also have
weekly breakfast with other friends. I don't want to jinx anything as I
feel life can't get much better than this - now I'll probably get hit by
a bus lol. Actually we played tennis the other night and there was a
cracking storm, if I had to go may as well be by lightning just after
I've served an ace on set point : )

This discussion is meant to be respectable discussion without personal attacks on other beliefs.

Ice and Skriptis, chill please.

Everyone should definitely 'chill' imo. Nothing else really works : )

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

UGV0ZVdhc0x1Y2t5IGtpcmpvaXR0aSAzLjMuMjAyNCBrbG8gMjEuMDM6DQo+IFNhd2Zpc2gg PHNhd2Zpc2g2NjZAZ21haWwuY29tPiBXcm90ZSBpbiBtZXNzYWdlOnINCj4+IE9uIDMvMy8y NCAyOjU3IEFNLCBXaGlzcGVyIHdyb3RlOj4gT24gMy8wMy8yMDI0IDY6MjAgYW0sIFBldGVX YXNMdWNreSB3cm90ZTo+PiBEbyB5b3UgYmVsaWV2ZSB0aGVyZSBpcyBhIEdvZCBvciBhIGNy ZWF0b3Ivcz8+Pj4+PiBHb2Qgbm8sICdjcmVhdG9yL3MnIGFsc28gbm8gaW4gYSByZWxpZ2lv dXMgc2Vuc2UuICBEZXBlbmRzIGhvdyBicm9hZGx5ID4gd2Ugd2FudCB0byBkZXNjcmliZSAn Y3JlYXRvcicuPj4+PiBJZiB5b3UgYmVsaWV2ZSB0aGVyZSBpcyBhIEdvZCBvciBDcmVhdG9y LCBkb2VzIHRoaXMgYmVsaWVmIGluZmx1ZW5jZSA+PiB5b3UgdG8gbGl2ZSB5b3VyIGxpZmUg aW4gc3BlY2lmaWMgd2F5PyBJZiB5ZXMsIGhvdz8+Pj4+IElmIHlvdSBkb24ndCBiZWxpZXZl IHRoZXJlIGlzIGEgR29kLCBkb24ndCB5b3UgZmVlbCB0aGF0IHdoYXQgd2UgbGl2ZSA+PiBp cyB0b28gcmFuZG9tLCA+PiBMaWZlIGNvdWxkbid0IGJlIG1vcmUgcmFuZG9tIGxvbC4gIFlv dXIgb2RkcyBvZiBiZWluZyBoZXJlIGFyZSAxIGluID4gNDAwIHRyaWxsaW9uLiAgVGhhdCBt ZWFucyB5b3UgYXJlIG1vcmUgbGlrZWx5IHRvIHdpbiB0aGUgbG90dGVyeSAxID4gbWlsbGlv biB0aW1lcyB0aGFuIGJlaW5nIGJvcm4uICBUaGF0J3MgYWJvdXQgYXMgY2xvc2UgdG8gemVy byBjaGFuY2UgPiBvZiBiZWluZyBib3JuIGFzIHdlIGNhbiBwb3NzaWJseSBjb250ZW1wbGF0 ZS4+Pj4+IGVtcHR5LCBhbmQgcHVycG9zZWxlc3M/IElmIG5vLCB0aGVuIGhvdyBkbyB5b3Ug ZmVlbD8+PiBJIGZlZWwgYW1hemluZy4gSSdtIGZ1bGx5IGF3YXJlIEkgYW0gZXh0cmVtZWx5 IGZvcnR1bmF0ZSB0byBub3Qgb25seSA+IGJlIGJvcm4gYnV0IHRvIGxpdmUgaW4gQXVzdHJh bGlhIGFuZCByaWRpY3Vsb3VzbHkgcHJpdmlsZWdlZCB0byBiZSBpbiA+IHRvcCAxJS4gIEkg Y2FuIGRvIHdoYXQgSSB3YW50IGV2ZXJ5IGRheSwgZ28gYW55d2hlcmUgaW4gdGhlIHdvcmxk IGlmIEkgPiB3YW50LCBhbmQgYnV5IGFueXRoaW5nIEkgd2FudCAtIHdpdGhpbiByZWFzb24g bG9sLCBJIGRvbid0IGFzcGlyZSB0byA+IG93biBmb290YmFsbCB0ZWFtcyBldGMgOiApLj4+ IE15ICdwdXJwb3NlJyBpcyB0byBqdXN0IGxpdmUgbXkgbGlmZSBhbmQgdHJ5IG5vdCB0byBo dXJ0IG90aGVycyBhbG9uZyA+IHRoZSB3YXksIGluZGVlZCBtYWtlIG90aGVycyBhIGJpdCBo YXBwaWVyIGlmIGl0IGRvZXNuJ3QgdGFrZSB0b28gbXVjaCA+IGVmZm9ydC4gIEkgcmVhbGl6 ZSBsaWZlIGlzIHNob3J0IGFuZCB0aGF0IHB1dHMgZXZlcnl0aGluZyBpbiA+IHBlcnNwZWN0 aXZlIGZvciBtZS4gIEkgaGF2ZSBubyBmZWFyIG9mIGRlYXRoIGFzIGl0J3MganVzdCBhIHN0 YXRlIG9mID4gbm9uIGV4aXN0ZW5jZSwgbGlrZSB0aGUgcGVyaW9kIGJlZm9yZSBJIHdhcyBi b3JuLiBJIHdhc24ndCA+IHN0cmVzc2VkL2FueGlvdXMgMjAwIHlycyBhZ28sIDEsMDAwIHly cyBhZ28sIHNvIEkgd29uJ3QgYmUgc3RyZXNzZWQgPiBhZnRlciBJIGRpZS4gIFN0cmVzc2lu ZywgYmVpbmcgYW54aW91cyBhYm91dCBkZWF0aCBldGMgaXMgYSBjb21wbGV0ZSA+IHdhc3Rl IG9mIHRpbWUgYXMgeW91IGNhbid0IGluZmx1ZW5jZSBhbnl0aGluZywgd2hlbiB5b3VyIG51 bWJlciBpcyB1cCA+IHRoYXQncyBpdC4gWW91IHdvbid0IG1pc3MgbGlmZSBhcyB5b3UnbGwg YmUgZGVhZCwgb25seSBsaXZpbmcgYmVpbmdzID4gY2FuIG1pc3Mgc29tZXRoaW5nLiAgSXQn cyBvbmx5IGEgYmlnIGRlYWwgaWYgeW91IGxldCBpdCBiZSBhIGJpZyBkZWFsID4gLSBpdCdz IHJlYWxseSBhcyBzaW1wbGUgYXMgdGhhdC4gIEFsc28gaWYgeW91IHJlYWNoIHJlYWxseSBh ZHZhbmNlZCA+IHllYXJzIEkgaW1hZ2luZSBkZWF0aCB3aWxsIGJlIGEgc3dlZXQgcmVsZWFz ZSBvZiBzb3J0cy4+PiBJIGZlZWwgdmVyeSBmb3J0dW5hdGUgdG8gYWxzbyBiZSBpbiBncmVh dCBoZWFsdGgsIGdldCB0byBwbGF5IHRlbm5pcyAzID4gdGltZXMgYSB3ZWVrIGFsbCB5ZWFy IGFyb3VuZCwgZ28gdG8gZ3ltL3N3aW0veW9nYSByZWd1bGFybHksID4gb2NjYXNpb25hbCBn b2xmLiBUaGUgd2lmZSBhbmQgSSBnbyB0byBjb25jZXJ0cyBhbmQgc2hvd3MgZXZlcnkgMiBv ciAzID4gd2Vla3MsIEkgYXR0ZW5kIHNvY2NlciBhbmQgcnVnYnkgZ2FtZXMgZXZlcnkgd2Vl ayB3aXRoICd0aGUgYm95cycsID4gYWxzbyBoYXZlIHdlZWtseSBicmVha2Zhc3Qgd2l0aCBv dGhlciBmcmllbmRzLiAgSSBkb24ndCB3YW50IHRvIGppbnggPiBhbnl0aGluZyBhcyBJIGZl ZWwgbGlmZSBjYW4ndCBnZXQgbXVjaCBiZXR0ZXIgdGhhbiB0aGlzIC0gbm93IEknbGwgPiBw cm9iYWJseSBnZXQgaGl0IGJ5IGEgYnVzIGxvbC4gQWN0dWFsbHkgd2UgcGxheWVkIHRlbm5p cyB0aGUgb3RoZXIgPiBuaWdodCBhbmQgdGhlcmUgd2FzIGEgY3JhY2tpbmcgc3Rvcm0sIGlm IEkgaGFkIHRvIGdvIG1heSBhcyB3ZWxsIGJlIGJ5ID4gbGlnaHRuaW5nIGp1c3QgYWZ0ZXIg SSd2ZSBzZXJ2ZWQgYW4gYWNlIG9uIHNldCBwb2ludCA6ICk+Pj4+Pj4gVGhpcyBkaXNjdXNz aW9uIGlzIG1lYW50IHRvIGJlIHJlc3BlY3RhYmxlIGRpc2N1c3Npb24gd2l0aG91dCA+PiBw ZXJzb25hbCBhdHRhY2tzIG9uIG90aGVyIGJlbGllZnMuPj4+PiBJY2UgYW5kIFNrcmlwdGlz LCBjaGlsbCBwbGVhc2UuPj4+IEV2ZXJ5b25lIHNob3VsZCBkZWZpbml0ZWx5ICdjaGlsbCcg aW1vLiAgTm90aGluZyBlbHNlIHJlYWxseSB3b3JrcyA6ICk+V2hpc3AsIGl0IGlzIHRoaXMg YXNwZWN0IG9mIHlvdXIgcG9zdHMgdGhhdCBtYWtlIGFsbCB0aGUgb3RoZXIgZ2xvYXRpbmcg c2hpdCB0b2xlcmFibGUuIEkgbWVhbiwgSSBoYXZlIHByb2JhYmx5IGFib3V0IHRoZSBzYW1l IGZpbmFuY2lhbCBzZXQgdXAgYXMgeW91IHNvIG9mdGVuIHB1dCBmb3J0aCwgYnV0IHN1cGVy c3RpdGlvdXMgZHJlYWQgY2F1c2VzIG1lIG5vdCB0byBnbG9hdCBhYm91dCBpdCBvdXRzaWRl IG9mIHRoZSBob3VzZS5JdCdzIGJhZCBqdS1qdSwgZm9yIHN1cmUsIGFuZCBpbnZpdGVzIHRy b3VibGUuICBIdW1pbGl0eSBpcyBub3Qgb25seSBhIGdyZWF0IHZpcnR1ZSwgYnV0IGEgYml0 Y2hpbicgY2FtbyBjb3ZlciwgdG9vLiBUaGUgY29udmVyc2UgaXMgdGhhdCBwcmlkZSBtYWtl cyB5b3UgYSB0YXJnZXQsIHdoZXJlIHlvdSB3b3VsZCBoYXZlIHNsaWQgdW5kZXIgdGhlIHJh ZGFyIHF1aXRlIGVhc2lseS5CdXQgeW91ciBkZXNjcmlwdGlvbiBvZiB3aGVyZSB5b3UgbGFu ZGVkLCBieSBibGluZCBjaGFuY2UsIGFuZCBpdHMgdW5saWtlbHkgaGVscGluZyBvZiBnb29k IGZvcnR1bmUsIGlzIGFsbW9zdCBteSBleGFjdCBhc3Nlc3NtZW50IG9mICpteSogbGlmZSwg YW5kIHJlYWxseSwgdG8gbWUsIHdoYXQgb3RoZXIgbGlmZSBpcyB0aGVyZT8gT3IgYW0gSSBz dXBwb3NlZCB0byBjYXJlIGZvciBvdGhlciBwZW9wbGVzJyBsaXZlcyByZWZsZXhpdmVseT8g SWYgc28sIHdobyBzYXlzIHNvLCBhbmQgd2h5IHdvdWxkIEkgYmVsaWV2ZSB0aGVtPyBJJ2xs IHBpY2sgYW5kIGNob29zZSB3aG8gdG8gY2FyZSBhYm91dCwgdGhhbmsgeW91Lkkgd2FzIHRo aW5raW5nIGFib3V0IFBldGUncyBpbml0aWFsIHF1ZXN0aW9ucyBhbmQgd2hhdCByZWFsbHkg Y2FtZSBjbGVhciB0byBtZSB3YXMgdGhhdCBzbyBmYXIgYXMgSSBjYW4gcmVtZW1iZXIsIEkg Km5ldmVyKiB3b25kZXJlZCBhYm91dCB3aGF0IHdhcyB0aGUgcHVycG9zZSBvZiBMaWZlLCBh bmQgd2hhdCB3YXMgbXkgcm9sZS4gVGhpbmtpbmcgYmFjaywgaXQgd2FzIGFsbW9zdCBlbnRp cmVseSAiaG93IGRvIEkgPG5hbWVZb3VyR29hbEhlcmU+Li4uIi4gSSB3YXMgb2NjdXBpZWQg YnkgbXkgZ29hbHMgYW5kIHVzZWQgbm8gY3ljbGVzIG9uIGNvc21pYyBzcGVjdWxhdGlvbi4g VGhlcmUgc2VlbWVkIG5vIGJlbmVmaXQgaW4gaXQuSWYgeW91IGRvbid0IGNhcmUgYWJvdXQg Y29zbW9sb2d5LCBpdCBkb2VzIGF3YXkgd2l0aCB0aGUgbmVlZCBmb3IgYSBwZXJ2YXNpdmUg Zm9ybWFsaXplZCByZWxpZ2lvdXMgc3RydWN0dXJlLi0tIH5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+ fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+fn5+ fiJXaGVuIEkgd2FzIGJhY2sgdGhlcmUgaW4gc2VtaW5hcnkgc2Nob29sLCB0aGVyZSB3YXMg YSBwZXJzb24gdGhlcmUgd2hvIHB1dCBmb3J0aCB0aGUgcHJvcG9zaXRpb24gdGhhdCB5b3Ug Y2FuIHBldGl0aW9uIHRoZSBMb3JkIHdpdGggcHJheWVyLi4uIlBldGl0aW9uIHRoZSBsb3Jk IHdpdGggcHJheWVyLi4uIlBldGl0aW9uIHRoZSBsb3JkIHdpdGggcHJheWVyLi4uIllPVSBD QU5OT1QgUEVUSVRJT04gVEhFIExPUkQgV0lUSCBQUkFZRVIhIi0tU2F3ZmlzaA0KPiANCj4g SXQncyB0aGUgdHlwaWNhbCBXaGlzcGVyIHBvc3RzLCBJIHdhcyBnb2luZyB0byBjb21tZW50 IHRoZW4gSSBrbmV3IHlvdSB3aWxsIHRha2UgY2FyZSBvZiBpdCA6KQ0KPiANCg0KSSBhbG1v c3QgcG9zdGVkIGEgcmVwbHkgY29udGVtcGxhdGluZyBob3cgdGhlcmUncyB0cm91YmxlIGlu IHBhcmFkaXNlIA0Kd2l0aCBoaXMgbmV3IHBob25lLi4uDQo=

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Sawfish <[email protected]> wrote:

For a while I've thought that when man killed God (as per Nietzsche)
there was a giant spiritual vacuum, and this has been filled with a
blind pursuit of immediate self-indulgence. Taking comfort from material tokens.

Agreed. To take one gigantic example, USA is a profoundly sick
society. At its rotten core lies the so-called American
Dream, i.e. from rags to riches.

Most of the Americans are conditioned to believe that having
material riches is the highest purpose in life. Timothy
Leary once tried to cure USA's sickness, but as a reward he
was put into jail for his efforts. Tim and his like-minded
friends were nothing but *political prisoners* in the
self-proclaimed "Land of The Free".

In Finland, the right-wing bastards are currently trying
to convert our country into some kind of a mini-USA.

Western mankind was nowhere near ready for this.

Maybe, but it just had to happen.

In order to become civilized and free from stupid
superstitions, we desperately have to get rid of the
*Abrahamic religions*. They are so incredibly evil,
outdated and backwards, that it cannot even be
expressed in words. Disgusting!

Smoking good weed and eating magic mushrooms can help
us in achieving this goal.

br,
KK

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)