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  • Demo ride flight waiver? Officer insurance?

    From Dan Kvinge@21:1/5 to All on Sun Sep 25 17:37:18 2022
    I'm an officer in a small USA midwestern soaring club that has successfully been in service for about 50 years. Recently another officer asked whether we should get "Officer Insurance" which covers some liability in case of a serious accident. I don't
    know much about it, and I am curious to know what other soaring clubs do.

    I have two questions:
    1) Does your club carry insurance that would provide extra protection for club officials? I'm not talking about the basic aircraft insurance we all carry.

    2) Does your club require signed "waivers" for visitors (non-members) who want to take an introductory ride? If you do I would be very interested in seeing such a waiver.

    Thanks for your assistance!

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  • From 2G@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sun Sep 25 22:32:13 2022
    On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 5:37:20 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    I'm an officer in a small USA midwestern soaring club that has successfully been in service for about 50 years. Recently another officer asked whether we should get "Officer Insurance" which covers some liability in case of a serious accident. I don't
    know much about it, and I am curious to know what other soaring clubs do.

    I have two questions:
    1) Does your club carry insurance that would provide extra protection for club officials? I'm not talking about the basic aircraft insurance we all carry.

    2) Does your club require signed "waivers" for visitors (non-members) who want to take an introductory ride? If you do I would be very interested in seeing such a waiver.

    Thanks for your assistance!

    By all means, have visitors sign a waiver. I don't have an example (been out of that too long), but the wording must be VERY specific; don't just use the word "injury," use "INJURY OR DEATH." I know of one club that didn't and lost a lawsuit because of
    it. Also, ALWAYS capitalize the important shit - really, the courts will hit you with a 2x4 if you don't.

    Tom

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  • From Gianni Isotope@21:1/5 to All on Mon Sep 26 07:14:48 2022
    One thing to keep in mind is that, depending upon the laws of your particular state, a liability waiver signed by a parent or guardian on behalf of a minor might have no legal effect. That is the case here in Illinois, where case law holds that only
    courts, and not parents or guardians, can waive the legal rights of minors. I suggest consulting a lawyer regarding whether waivers signed on behalf of minors are effective in your state and, if they are not, your club seriously consider whether it is
    worth the risk to give rides to children.

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  • From =?UTF-8?Q?John_DeRosa_OHM_=E2=84=A6@21:1/5 to All on Mon Sep 26 08:26:56 2022
    My club has separate waivers for members and for guests. I can get copies to you.

    We also have D&O (directors and officers) insurance which we think is important.

    Contact me via my information found on members.ssa.org.

    John DeRosa

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  • From Roy B.@21:1/5 to All on Mon Sep 26 14:40:31 2022
    Check your particular state's legislation regarding volunteer officer & director liability for non profit organizations before paying money for an insurance policy that "covers" an illusory risk. Many states have a statute protecting such volunteers from
    vicarious liability - but it varies from state to state. In 45 years practicing law I have never seen a successful lawsuit brought or attempted against non profit officers or directors for an accident that they were not personally and directly involved
    with. I think a CFI insurance policy is a good idea for a club - but insurance on the Officers and Directors is a solution in search of a problem.

    Written pre-accident waivers and liability releases are sometimes helpful but they are not a cure all. Enforceability of such waivers varies from state to state and they are almost never enforced against claimants who did not sign the document (like the
    family members of a person injured or killed).

    ROY

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  • From Frank Whiteley@21:1/5 to Roy B. on Tue Sep 27 21:46:21 2022
    On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 3:40:33 PM UTC-6, Roy B. wrote:
    Check your particular state's legislation regarding volunteer officer & director liability for non profit organizations before paying money for an insurance policy that "covers" an illusory risk. Many states have a statute protecting such volunteers
    from vicarious liability - but it varies from state to state. In 45 years practicing law I have never seen a successful lawsuit brought or attempted against non profit officers or directors for an accident that they were not personally and directly
    involved with. I think a CFI insurance policy is a good idea for a club - but insurance on the Officers and Directors is a solution in search of a problem.

    Written pre-accident waivers and liability releases are sometimes helpful but they are not a cure all. Enforceability of such waivers varies from state to state and they are almost never enforced against claimants who did not sign the document (like
    the family members of a person injured or killed).

    ROY
    I second what Roy suggests. Some states' statutes require the organization to indemnify the organization's directors and officers so would likely be named in any actions, but those types of actions are limited, as are the types of coverages. The CFI-G
    insurance is a good idea.

    Frank

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  • From Dan Kvinge@21:1/5 to All on Tue Oct 4 19:59:13 2022
    Thanks for everyone's good suggestions and copies of waivers. I realized there are an almost unlimited number of waivers available, and all are different. There were good points about the differences between states too, and also giving minors rides.
    I also agree that a waiver will almost certainly not prevent a lawsuit, but it may still be useful none the less. I don't need to expound on any of that here.
    Also, we will review our insurance situation. There is no end of possible options for liability insurance, and few of us can afford to insure against every possible event (slips, falls, carts, etc).

    Thanks again for the helpful knowledge base.

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Thu Oct 6 09:37:34 2022
    My understanding is that the corporate veil in most states greatly protects the officers and directors of non-profit entities. That said, Sandhill Soaring Club, a Michigan registered non-profit corporation, and IRS registered 501(c)(3), obtained D&O
    insurance this year from a local insurance broker for about $650/year that protects (defends) us from both outsiders and our own members. If you want good board members (with means and something to loose should they be sued), to participate in your club'
    s governance, this may be something you want to look into for your club. You have to read your D&O policy carefully to make sure the coverage defends you from members as well, and covers situations involving aircraft and carrying passengers.

    As an aside, Sandhill Soaring Club also carries additional instructors insurance, which is a rider added to our normal SSA/Costello/AIG policy for SSA Chapters that provides our CFIGs with additional coverage.

    Waivers are largely untested in the courts I believe but we did get a copy of a waiver indirectly from Mike Shakman, an Chicago lawyer, that was based on IL law I presume. You would want to have a local attorney look it over and check local caselaw to
    determine whether the waiver is worth the paper its written on in your state. At least it gives you a fighting chance and something to argue about (encourage a settlement). One way of dealing with the liability issue is to make guests "Introductory
    Members" of your club (something the SSA's FAST Package encouraged), subject to your own bylaws and membership conditions, at the time you provide them the Introductory Ride. This too seems like an imperfect solution.

    Disclaimer: I am not an attorney and I am NOT providing any legal advice. Please consult a licensed attorney who is a member of the Bar in your state before acting on this or any other information you read in this forum.

    - Chris Schrader, President
    Sandhill Soaring Club
    *SSA Director, Region 6 (MI, OH, IN, KY)

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