While I understand all the traffic about Thunderbird, etc., it is self-defeating. The whole idea of the internet is simplicity, not trying to avoid spamming, scamming, phishing, etc. i will not load yet another app on my computer to filter all thespams rec.aviation.soaring is getting. From my perspective, the website is dead due to the spams, which are now 90% of what is being posted, probably by bots. Have fun guys. I'm gone.
It's odd. If I look at some uk telecom groups that I gave up reading ages ago, due to spam, there is now nearly no spam, and regular though though not frequent relevant poststhose not yet posting, and maybe ask the admin to bar an address IP range. That would be useful here, given some non Latin scripts implying common origins
In those days you could report spam on Google Groups, and it would eventually disappear, albeit maybe 3 to 6 weeks later. But then the cleanups tailed off.
At the same time I disabled forwarding this email address to other gmail addresses, as there was spam there too, presumably from bots reading the email address
On ordinary forums, some moderators just hide posts, but others will search all posts by a username, delete them all off the platform in blocks, ban the user from more posts, maybe search on its IP address range to detect other suspects, including
Cleaning up here would take just a few minutes, but digressing as I suggest would probably delete tens of thousands of posts across other groupsspams rec.aviation.soaring is getting. From my perspective, the website is dead due to the spams, which are now 90% of what is being posted, probably by bots. Have fun guys. I'm gone.
I don't know if there is any way for such tools to be available to nominated persons on newsgroups. Presumably not
On Saturday, 18 November 2023 at 00:22:13 UTC, Eric Bick (DY) wrote:
While I understand all the traffic about Thunderbird, etc., it is self-defeating. The whole idea of the internet is simplicity, not trying to avoid spamming, scamming, phishing, etc. i will not load yet another app on my computer to filter all the
IMHOmethod possible. Basically, <CLICK HERE> and instantly get content.
RAS has a rich and vibrant history and is a great reservoir of content. but in this day and age of TikTok, FB, Twitter (X), etc, etc, how can we help invite new soaring people to our RAS discussion forum? We need to provide them the easiest and fastest
We can easily provide a simple web link to get to RAS (i.e. https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring). Unfortunately, this current access to RAS has become almost impossible to view with so much chaff amongst the wheat. Every USENET group Iused to view has become the same way. Very sad. Blame AI and bots? Who knows.
Our best solution thus far to remove the chaff is to use, and configure, a newsgroup viewing and filtering tool like Thunderbird. Based on my working with our club's membership this is simply too high of a hurdle for them.
Suggestions:
- Has anyone created an instruction manual (PDF) on how to download, install, update, and configure Thunderbird or the like?
- Does a simple link exist for the user to get directly to an already moderated "clean" version of rec.aviation.soaring?
I would think that these things could be created by our soaring techies. Heck, look at OGN and OLC to see what soaring technology can be brought to bear.
My $0.02.
John (OHM)
Founder of RAS_Prime (https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime)
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 5:44:41 PM UTC-7, John DeRosa OHM Ω http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:fastest method possible. Basically, <CLICK HERE> and instantly get content.
IMHO
RAS has a rich and vibrant history and is a great reservoir of content. but in this day and age of TikTok, FB, Twitter (X), etc, etc, how can we help invite new soaring people to our RAS discussion forum? We need to provide them the easiest and
used to view has become the same way. Very sad. Blame AI and bots? Who knows.We can easily provide a simple web link to get to RAS (i.e. https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring). Unfortunately, this current access to RAS has become almost impossible to view with so much chaff amongst the wheat. Every USENET group I
to use some specific app, other than what they’ve been using for this one purpose is a loser. Yes, of course, these apps can be used for more than RAS, but how do you convince someone to change from what they’ve been using for the past 20 years? InOur best solution thus far to remove the chaff is to use, and configure, a newsgroup viewing and filtering tool like Thunderbird. Based on my working with our club's membership this is simply too high of a hurdle for them.
Suggestions:
- Has anyone created an instruction manual (PDF) on how to download, install, update, and configure Thunderbird or the like?
- Does a simple link exist for the user to get directly to an already moderated "clean" version of rec.aviation.soaring?
I would think that these things could be created by our soaring techies. Heck, look at OGN and OLC to see what soaring technology can be brought to bear.
My $0.02.
John (OHM)I like the last part. IMHO, saying one has to use a this or that app does not resolve the issue. In the legend of the Dutch boy who put his finger in the dike to stop a leak was only a bandaid, and did not help the population as a whole. Saying one has
Founder of RAS_Prime (https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime)
Eric B. (No longer a user of RAS, other than to vent.)
One must wonder why Google does not use spam filtering or servers like Eternal November to fix the issue not just for RAS but for all newsgroups accessed from Google? They already implement spam filters in their email servers so why not for newsgroups?fastest method possible. Basically, <CLICK HERE> and instantly get content.
Ramy
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 7:35:04 PM UTC-8, Eric Bick (DY) wrote:
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 5:44:41 PM UTC-7, John DeRosa OHM Ω http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:
IMHO
RAS has a rich and vibrant history and is a great reservoir of content. but in this day and age of TikTok, FB, Twitter (X), etc, etc, how can we help invite new soaring people to our RAS discussion forum? We need to provide them the easiest and
used to view has become the same way. Very sad. Blame AI and bots? Who knows.We can easily provide a simple web link to get to RAS (i.e. https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring). Unfortunately, this current access to RAS has become almost impossible to view with so much chaff amongst the wheat. Every USENET group I
has to use some specific app, other than what they’ve been using for this one purpose is a loser. Yes, of course, these apps can be used for more than RAS, but how do you convince someone to change from what they’ve been using for the past 20 years?Our best solution thus far to remove the chaff is to use, and configure, a newsgroup viewing and filtering tool like Thunderbird. Based on my working with our club's membership this is simply too high of a hurdle for them.
Suggestions:
- Has anyone created an instruction manual (PDF) on how to download, install, update, and configure Thunderbird or the like?
- Does a simple link exist for the user to get directly to an already moderated "clean" version of rec.aviation.soaring?
I would think that these things could be created by our soaring techies. Heck, look at OGN and OLC to see what soaring technology can be brought to bear.
My $0.02.
John (OHM)I like the last part. IMHO, saying one has to use a this or that app does not resolve the issue. In the legend of the Dutch boy who put his finger in the dike to stop a leak was only a bandaid, and did not help the population as a whole. Saying one
Founder of RAS_Prime (https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime)
Well.....at least Google added the blue stop sign at the top of a post to report a thread. Saves a whole step in reporting.Eric B. (No longer a user of RAS, other than to vent.)
I just looked in on groups.google.com and r.a.s really is unusably bad. Pages and pages of repetitive spam.
Looking at a few other USENET groups at random in the rec.* branches, I didn't see this much junk.
Using the google page, there is a gear icon... one of the options there is "send feedback to google", which I did.
Worth a try, but I'm not holding my breath.
As far as a primer, I don't think it can be much easier than the following. There's just too much variability in platforms & ISPs
and preferences. There is probably more than one way to set up t-bird, I'll just describe what works for me.
I can't speak to phone/tablet versions since I don't use them for USENET. Others are.
-- --
1. Download and install an appropriate (free) version of mozilla thunderbird. You don't have to change whatever you're doing now
with email. Here: https://www.thunderbird.net/
2. Go to "https://www.eternal-september.org/" and "register", with your name, and an arbitrary userID and an email E-S can contact
you with. (Free). This email address, and userID are only used for contacting the E-S server and are not published. Once
registered, you should receive an email with a generated password and other instructions from E-S.
3. Start and configure thunderbird. "File -> New -> Newsgroup Account". At this point you will be prompted for a display name and
email address, which *will* be used for your public messages in the newsgroup. Select the new group you created and you should see a
page with setup options. Click on the top line "Account settings" and set thunderbird to point to the news server and port mentioned
in the email from step 2, above. The first time you connect, you will receive a pop-up prompt for the userID/password you
registered with E-S. If it helps, for configuration on os X I am using Server Name: news.eternal-september.org
Port: 563
Connection security: SSL/TLS
To send messages, you will also need a "SMTP" SimpleMailTransferProtocol server. Look into your ISP documentation or current email
setup for what that needs to be. I am using my ISP:
Server Name: smtp.comcast.net
Port: 465
Connection security: SSL/TLS
Authentication method: Normal password
User Name: [email protected]
4. "subscribe" to rec.aviation.soaring. (Free). The key press varies, but on OS X, a control-click on the newsgroup you created
brings up a pop-up menu including "subscribe". You can use this to check the box for R.A.S. and whatever else you want.
--Fin--newsgroups?
On 11/21/23 10:12 PM, Ramy wrote:
One must wonder why Google does not use spam filtering or servers like Eternal November to fix the issue not just for RAS but for all newsgroups accessed from Google? They already implement spam filters in their email servers so why not for
fastest method possible. Basically, <CLICK HERE> and instantly get content.Ramy
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 7:35:04 PM UTC-8, Eric Bick (DY) wrote:
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 5:44:41 PM UTC-7, John DeRosa OHM Ω http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:
IMHO
RAS has a rich and vibrant history and is a great reservoir of content. but in this day and age of TikTok, FB, Twitter (X), etc, etc, how can we help invite new soaring people to our RAS discussion forum? We need to provide them the easiest and
used to view has become the same way. Very sad. Blame AI and bots? Who knows.
We can easily provide a simple web link to get to RAS (i.e. https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring). Unfortunately, this current access to RAS has become almost impossible to view with so much chaff amongst the wheat. Every USENET group I
has to use some specific app, other than what they’ve been using for this one purpose is a loser. Yes, of course, these apps can be used for more than RAS, but how do you convince someone to change from what they’ve been using for the past 20 years?I like the last part. IMHO, saying one has to use a this or that app does not resolve the issue. In the legend of the Dutch boy who put his finger in the dike to stop a leak was only a bandaid, and did not help the population as a whole. Saying one
Our best solution thus far to remove the chaff is to use, and configure, a newsgroup viewing and filtering tool like Thunderbird. Based on my working with our club's membership this is simply too high of a hurdle for them.
Suggestions:
- Has anyone created an instruction manual (PDF) on how to download, install, update, and configure Thunderbird or the like?
- Does a simple link exist for the user to get directly to an already moderated "clean" version of rec.aviation.soaring?
I would think that these things could be created by our soaring techies. Heck, look at OGN and OLC to see what soaring technology can be brought to bear.
My $0.02.
John (OHM)
Founder of RAS_Prime (https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime)
Eric B. (No longer a user of RAS, other than to vent.)
I just looked in on groups.google.com and r.a.s really is unusably
bad. Pages and pages of repetitive spam.
Looking at a few other USENET groups at random in the rec.* branches,
I didn't see this much junk.
Using the google page, there is a gear icon... one of the options
there is "send feedback to google", which I did.
Worth a try, but I'm not holding my breath.
As far as a primer, I don't think it can be much easier than the
following. There's just too much variability in platforms & ISPs and preferences. There is probably more than one way to set up t-bird,
I'll just describe what works for me.
I can't speak to phone/tablet versions since I don't use them for
USENET. Others are.
-- --
1. Download and install an appropriate (free) version of mozilla
thunderbird. You don't have to change whatever you're doing now with
email. Here: https://www.thunderbird.net/
2. Go to "https://www.eternal-september.org/" and "register", with
your name, and an arbitrary userID and an email E-S can contact you
with. (Free). This email address, and userID are only used for
contacting the E-S server and are not published. Once registered, you should receive an email with a generated password and other
instructions from E-S.
3. Start and configure thunderbird. "File -> New -> Newsgroup
Account". At this point you will be prompted for a display name and
email address, which *will* be used for your public messages in the newsgroup. Select the new group you created and you should see a page
with setup options. Click on the top line "Account settings" and set thunderbird to point to the news server and port mentioned in the
email from step 2, above. The first time you connect, you will
receive a pop-up prompt for the userID/password you registered with
E-S. If it helps, for configuration on os X I am using
Server Name: news.eternal-september.org
Port: 563
Connection security: SSL/TLS
To send messages, you will also need a "SMTP"
SimpleMailTransferProtocol server. Look into your ISP documentation
or current email setup for what that needs to be. I am using my ISP: Server Name: smtp.comcast.net
Port: 465
Connection security: SSL/TLS
Authentication method: Normal password
User Name: [email protected]
4. "subscribe" to rec.aviation.soaring. (Free). The key press varies,
but on OS X, a control-click on the newsgroup you created brings up a
pop-up menu including "subscribe". You can use this to check the box
for R.A.S. and whatever else you want.
--Fin--
On 11/21/23 10:12 PM, Ramy wrote:
One must wonder why Google does not use spam filtering or servers
like Eternal November to fix the issue not just for RAS but for all
newsgroups accessed from Google? They already implement spam filters
in their email servers so why not for newsgroups?
Ramy
On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 7:35:04 PM UTC-8, Eric Bick (DY) wrote: >>> On Sunday, November 19, 2023 at 5:44:41 PM UTC-7, John DeRosa OHM Ω
http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:
IMHOI like the last part. IMHO, saying one has to use a this or that app
RAS has a rich and vibrant history and is a great reservoir of
content. but in this day and age of TikTok, FB, Twitter (X), etc,
etc, how can we help invite new soaring people to our RAS
discussion forum? We need to provide them the easiest and fastest
method possible. Basically, <CLICK HERE> and instantly get content.
We can easily provide a simple web link to get to RAS (i.e.
https://groups.google.com/g/rec.aviation.soaring). Unfortunately,
this current access to RAS has become almost impossible to view
with so much chaff amongst the wheat. Every USENET group I used to
view has become the same way. Very sad. Blame AI and bots? Who knows.
Our best solution thus far to remove the chaff is to use, and
configure, a newsgroup viewing and filtering tool like Thunderbird.
Based on my working with our club's membership this is simply too
high of a hurdle for them.
Suggestions:
- Has anyone created an instruction manual (PDF) on how to
download, install, update, and configure Thunderbird or the like?
- Does a simple link exist for the user to get directly to an
already moderated "clean" version of rec.aviation.soaring?
I would think that these things could be created by our soaring
techies. Heck, look at OGN and OLC to see what soaring technology
can be brought to bear.
My $0.02.
John (OHM)
Founder of RAS_Prime (https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime)
does not resolve the issue. In the legend of the Dutch boy who put
his finger in the dike to stop a leak was only a bandaid, and did
not help the population as a whole. Saying one has to use some
specific app, other than what they’ve been using for this one
purpose is a loser. Yes, of course, these apps can be used for more
than RAS, but how do you convince someone to change from what
they’ve been using for the past 20 years? In years past, I loved
implementing the solution to my similar problems, but this is, as
John points out, a different world. For the population as a whole,
email is a tool and most can’t get beyond setting it up, regardless
of the app. Suggesting using Thunderbird seems to solve the issue
for the one user, but not the population as a whole. There is no
reason I can’t put thunderbird on my computer to solve the RAS issue
for me, but why should I have to do that? RAS has been a valuable
asset, but unless the basic issue is solved (and not bandaided
over), users are going to start disappearing for reasons John
specified. If you were to tell a newbie that RAS is a great tool,
but they have to install AppFilterSpam, maybe some will, but most
won’t, again IMHO.
Eric B. (No longer a user of RAS, other than to vent.)
Dan,click there, install this, configure that, then remove these.". That doesn't welcome the unwashed to our favorite soaring forum.
It would be disingenuous of me if I were to say ]that I somehow knew ahead of time about what has now happened to RAS in the last 2 months. It is very sad indeed. I wish it were not so. But it is so.
But I think you are missing a point or two about what you said:
- You won't lose access to the legacy of useful information existing on RAS which is our collective tribal knowledge. It will remain there forever in RAS and accessible.
- You are used to, and continue to experience, the beauty of a clean RAS. But any new user who is shown RAS as it is right now will look at it with consternation and confusion. He will ask "Where is the information?". You will answer, "Click here,
- We were all "spoon-fed" at some point at the beginning of our use of RAS and flying gliders.
- Those "coddled few" you mention are actuality in the majority.
- You like "unmoderated and uncensored". I do too. RAS_Prime is "unmoderated and uncensored". Unless, of course, someone is a spammer.
- With RAS you can't add a picture to your post. With RAS you can't add a document to your post. These are valuable things and worth a thousand words.
- You talk about how you remove an offending email address with a few clicks. True, it is not too difficult. But, unfortunately this is a never-ending battle as spammers seldom use the same address twice to avoid deletion.
I feel that we must move on.
Regards, John DeRosa
West Dundee, IL
Can't we get this under control again if everybody starts reporting all these messages as spam to google? I started doing that yesterday and think that if more people report it as spam google might actually realize it really is spam.I agree, it's at least worth a try. I started about a week ago, and went right back to the beginning of it ~6 weeks ago.
Regards, Gijs Doeglas
Can't we get this under control again if everybody starts reporting all these messages as spam to google? I started doing that yesterday and think that if more people report it as spam google might actually realize it really is spam.I agree, it's at least worth a try. I started about a week ago, and went right back to the beginning of it ~6 weeks ago.
Regards, Gijs Doeglas
But could it be that Google isn't interested, because they are just mirroring some other site? Or is that an urban myth?
James.
Google is your friend. Yeah, remember when they started up their motto
was (or included the phrase) "Do no harm"? I think they dropped that...
It was "Don't be evil", and they still say that. It's just ...er... de-emphasized.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_be_evil
On Tuesday, November 28, 2023 at 10:10:30 AM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
Google is your friend. Yeah, remember when they started up their motto
was (or included the phrase) "Do no harm"? I think they dropped that...
Dan,click there, install this, configure that, then remove these.". That doesn't welcome the unwashed to our favorite soaring forum.
It would be disingenuous of me if I were to say ]that I somehow knew ahead of time about what has now happened to RAS in the last 2 months. It is very sad indeed. I wish it were not so. But it is so.
But I think you are missing a point or two about what you said:
- You won't lose access to the legacy of useful information existing on RAS which is our collective tribal knowledge. It will remain there forever in RAS and accessible.
- You are used to, and continue to experience, the beauty of a clean RAS. But any new user who is shown RAS as it is right now will look at it with consternation and confusion. He will ask "Where is the information?". You will answer, "Click here,
- We were all "spoon-fed" at some point at the beginning of our use of RAS and flying gliders.Interesting about this conversation is that RAS Prime was started long before the October 27 or so flooding of spam. I recently went back to the first posting of RAS Prime and noticed that one of the main objections to RAS was the content and not the
- Those "coddled few" you mention are actuality in the majority.
- You like "unmoderated and uncensored". I do too. RAS_Prime is "unmoderated and uncensored". Unless, of course, someone is a spammer.
- With RAS you can't add a picture to your post. With RAS you can't add a document to your post. These are valuable things and worth a thousand words.
- You talk about how you remove an offending email address with a few clicks. True, it is not too difficult. But, unfortunately this is a never-ending battle as spammers seldom use the same address twice to avoid deletion.
I feel that we must move on.
Regards, John DeRosa
West Dundee, IL
On Tuesday, November 28, 2023 at 1:03:14 AM UTC-5, John DeRosa OHM Ω http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:click there, install this, configure that, then remove these.". That doesn't welcome the unwashed to our favorite soaring forum.
Dan,
It would be disingenuous of me if I were to say ]that I somehow knew ahead of time about what has now happened to RAS in the last 2 months. It is very sad indeed. I wish it were not so. But it is so.
But I think you are missing a point or two about what you said:
- You won't lose access to the legacy of useful information existing on RAS which is our collective tribal knowledge. It will remain there forever in RAS and accessible.
- You are used to, and continue to experience, the beauty of a clean RAS. But any new user who is shown RAS as it is right now will look at it with consternation and confusion. He will ask "Where is the information?". You will answer, "Click here,
abundance of spam. RAS Prime was first introduced over 18 months ago and as I have noted on several occasions the participation has been minimal to say the least. Moving forward to a more current timeline the spam on RAS has forced many including myself- We were all "spoon-fed" at some point at the beginning of our use of RAS and flying gliders.
- Those "coddled few" you mention are actuality in the majority.
- You like "unmoderated and uncensored". I do too. RAS_Prime is "unmoderated and uncensored". Unless, of course, someone is a spammer.
- With RAS you can't add a picture to your post. With RAS you can't add a document to your post. These are valuable things and worth a thousand words.
- You talk about how you remove an offending email address with a few clicks. True, it is not too difficult. But, unfortunately this is a never-ending battle as spammers seldom use the same address twice to avoid deletion.
I feel that we must move on.
Regards, John DeRosaInteresting about this conversation is that RAS Prime was started long before the October 27 or so flooding of spam. I recently went back to the first posting of RAS Prime and noticed that one of the main objections to RAS was the content and not the
West Dundee, IL
My question is this, If RAS Prime is not about content then why was it introduced long before the deluge of spam? My own observation was that RAS Prime was a content control platform, please correct me if I am wrong. RAS Prime was NOT developed as anunmoderated or uncensored venue, not that I dislike the venue, I do think that it has advantages over the current RAS, but it was not hardly used until the current flooding of mushrooms, Zanax, penis worshipers, and other fruitcake indulgences. Old Bob,
Who is the Admin of this group, because when I click on "About" of this group, it says that "anyone on the Web" can post messages? Isn't that easy to change?Yes, but you would need Google to do something. So far, they haven't.
Thanks, Sarah. Good to know there's still someone out there.
Dan 5J
On 11/28/23 12:48, Sarah wrote:
It was "Don't be evil", and they still say that. It's just ...er... de-emphasized.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_be_evil
On Tuesday, November 28, 2023 at 10:10:30 AM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
Google is your friend. Yeah, remember when they started up their motto >>> was (or included the phrase) "Do no harm"? I think they dropped that... >>>
On 12/3/2023 11:55 AM, Sarah Anderson wrote:
Not for much longer I fear. The group is choked with spam and the few
who switched to eternal-september seem to be a small minority of RAS
users.
My motivation to keep RAS alive is a deep distrust of large
corporations and a desire to maintain Usenet as it is.
Decentralized, uncensored (except for spam), and optionally
anonymous. Just like being in public, and not owned by Google.
Seriously, if corporations are people they tend to psychopathy.
On 11/28/23 4:48 PM, Dan Marotta wrote:
Thanks, Sarah. Good to know there's still someone out there.
Dan 5J
On 11/28/23 12:48, Sarah wrote:
It was "Don't be evil", and they still say that. It's just ...er...
de-emphasized.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_be_evil
On Tuesday, November 28, 2023 at 10:10:30 AM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote: >>>>> Google is your friend. Yeah, remember when they started up their
motto
was (or included the phrase) "Do no harm"? I think they dropped
that...
I agree with your sentiments, Sarah. I was participating in Usenet
before "the internet" existed, let alone the "world wide web". So
maybe I'm sentimental and naive. But I miss those days when the participants were voluntarily civil.
And I don't like Google owning everything and tracking everything
about us. RAS-Prime is set up on Google Groups, so it's still owned
by Google. I'd be a bit happier if it was on some other "platform"
(such as groups.io), but those are all centrally owned and may go
"poof" at any time. Usenet is not owned by anybody, and is
distributed, so that if or when any single repository goes poof it
still leaves all the others intact. Where else but on Usenet can you
search for postings from 20+ years ago? Note how Yahoo Groups got
booted, with all the posting history there lost, except for those
groups that bothered to copy all their postings to a new platform in
time. The new platform each such group chose cannot be counted on for
the long term either.
This is also one of the many reasons I don't touch Facebook: besides
being commercial and spying on you etc, it is just not a long-term
strategy for a "collective memory". I keep wishing somebody would
come up with a decentralized model for "social media". Since each
persons' social connections are "localized" around that person, and
only venture farther out to a finite and diminishing extent, it seems
that storing the data locally (within the computers owned by the
person, with copies of relevant parts tending to be stored on that
person's "friends") is a possible model. I gather some young man was working on such software, and mysteriously dropped dead a few years
ago. Nothing to see here, keep moving along...
On Thursday 7 December 2023 at 15:38:54 UTC, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote: >>>> On Wednesday, November 22, 2023 at 11:03:45 AM UTC-6, Sarah Anderson wrote:
I just looked in on groups.google.com and r.a.s really is unusably bad. Pages and pages of repetitive spam.Well, I will agree that is simpler than the 212 page Guide to Civil Aircraft Registry Electronic Services. CARES, for those who love the government and their acronyms.
Looking at a few other USENET groups at random in the rec.* branches, I didn't see this much junk.
Using the google page, there is a gear icon... one of the options there is "send feedback to google", which I did.
Worth a try, but I'm not holding my breath.
As far as a primer, I don't think it can be much easier than the following. There's just too much variability in platforms & ISPs
and preferences. There is probably more than one way to set up t-bird, I'll just describe what works for me.
I can't speak to phone/tablet versions since I don't use them for USENET. Others are.
-- --
1. Download and install an appropriate (free) version of mozilla thunderbird. You don't have to change whatever you're doing now
with email. Here: https://www.thunderbird.net/
2. Go to "https://www.eternal-september.org/" and "register", with your name, and an arbitrary userID and an email E-S can contact
you with. (Free). This email address, and userID are only used for contacting the E-S server and are not published. Once
registered, you should receive an email with a generated password and other instructions from E-S.
3. Start and configure thunderbird. "File -> New -> Newsgroup Account". At this point you will be prompted for a display name and
email address, which *will* be used for your public messages in the newsgroup. Select the new group you created and you should see a
page with setup options. Click on the top line "Account settings" and set thunderbird to point to the news server and port mentioned
in the email from step 2, above. The first time you connect, you will receive a pop-up prompt for the userID/password you
registered with E-S. If it helps, for configuration on os X I am using >>>>> Server Name: news.eternal-september.org
Port: 563
Connection security: SSL/TLS
To send messages, you will also need a "SMTP" SimpleMailTransferProtocol server. Look into your ISP documentation or current email
setup for what that needs to be. I am using my ISP:
Server Name: smtp.comcast.net
Port: 465
Connection security: SSL/TLS
Authentication method: Normal password
User Name: [email protected]
4. "subscribe" to rec.aviation.soaring. (Free). The key press varies, but on OS X, a control-click on the newsgroup you created
brings up a pop-up menu including "subscribe". You can use this to check the box for R.A.S. and whatever else you want.
--Fin--
https://www.faa.gov/media/66806
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of Regulated
I have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS answer
I've been continuing on a daily basis since my post on 28Nov - around 100 spams a day (and being careful not to knobble the occasional real posts).Using "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Sad, I know, but it *is* raining ;-o)
With several of us doing this, perhaps we will (eventually) not be ignored by Google as nutters? !! ???
James.
...And all of this is because some (perhaps many) glider pilots can not or don't want to
learn how to use a newsreader.
Since I haven't seen much relevant glider-centric discussion in quite some time and my
tolerance of the motorglider vs. pure glider controversy (?) is dwindling and my lack of
interest in who's on the world or national teams is growing, it won't be long before I
say, "Hasta la vista, Baby".
Dan 5J
On 12/7/23 09:27, [email protected] wrote:
On Thursday 7 December 2023 at 15:38:54 UTC, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002I've been continuing on a daily basis since my post on 28Nov - around 100 spams a day
owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote: >>>>> On Wednesday, November 22, 2023 at 11:03:45 AM UTC-6, Sarah Anderson wrote:Using "mass method", I just...
Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blueI just looked in on groups.google.com and r.a.s really is unusably bad. Pages andWell, I will agree that is simpler than the 212 page Guide to Civil Aircraft Registry
pages of repetitive spam.
Looking at a few other USENET groups at random in the rec.* branches, I didn't see
this much junk.
Using the google page, there is a gear icon... one of the options there is "send
feedback to google", which I did.
Worth a try, but I'm not holding my breath.
As far as a primer, I don't think it can be much easier than the following. There's
just too much variability in platforms & ISPs
and preferences. There is probably more than one way to set up t-bird, I'll just
describe what works for me.
I can't speak to phone/tablet versions since I don't use them for USENET. Others are.
-- --
1. Download and install an appropriate (free) version of mozilla thunderbird. You
don't have to change whatever you're doing now
with email. Here: https://www.thunderbird.net/
2. Go to "https://www.eternal-september.org/" and "register", with your name, and an
arbitrary userID and an email E-S can contact
you with. (Free). This email address, and userID are only used for contacting the
E-S server and are not published. Once
registered, you should receive an email with a generated password and other
instructions from E-S.
3. Start and configure thunderbird. "File -> New -> Newsgroup Account". At this
point you will be prompted for a display name and
email address, which *will* be used for your public messages in the newsgroup.
Select the new group you created and you should see a
page with setup options. Click on the top line "Account settings" and set
thunderbird to point to the news server and port mentioned
in the email from step 2, above. The first time you connect, you will receive a
pop-up prompt for the userID/password you
registered with E-S. If it helps, for configuration on os X I am using >>>>>> Server Name: news.eternal-september.org
Port: 563
Connection security: SSL/TLS
To send messages, you will also need a "SMTP" SimpleMailTransferProtocol server.
Look into your ISP documentation or current email
setup for what that needs to be. I am using my ISP:
Server Name: smtp.comcast.net
Port: 465
Connection security: SSL/TLS
Authentication method: Normal password
User Name: [email protected]
4. "subscribe" to rec.aviation.soaring. (Free). The key press varies, but on OS X, a
control-click on the newsgroup you created
brings up a pop-up menu including "subscribe". You can use this to check the box for
R.A.S. and whatever else you want.
--Fin--
Electronic Services. CARES, for those who love the government and their acronyms.
https://www.faa.gov/media/66806
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper
Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try
selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any
that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of Regulated
Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than
just "Spam".
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you
please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is
hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS answer I have
seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless
as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Steve Leonard
stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that,
there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
(and being careful not to knobble the occasional real posts).
Sad, I know, but it *is* raining ;-o)
With several of us doing this, perhaps we will (eventually) not be ignored by Google as
nutters? !! ???
James.
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote: ......
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of Regulated
have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS answer I
I was also reporting the spam until the flood became a tsunami.Using "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Looks like Google found a “solution” to the problem. They removing newsgroups support all together.is done today.”
“
Effective February 22, 2024, Google Groups will no longer support new Usenet content. Posting and subscribing will be disallowed, and new content from Usenet peers will not appear. Viewing and searching of historical data will still be supported as it
FWIW I have a feeling the reason for the sudden spams is someone started forwarding all spam’s to RAS.Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
We need a new moderated Google group, or groups.io. I believe very few folks still use newsreaders nowadays.
Ramy
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 5:20:25 PM UTC-8, Charles Coyne wrote:
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 1:11:17 PM UTC-8, Eric G wrote:
On 12/7/2023 7:38 AM, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote: >>> ......
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of Regulated
answer I have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS
Since I am unable to read the many foreign languages in the barrage, I'm assuming they are all hate mail, and reporting them as such rather than simple spam.I was also reporting the spam until the flood became a tsunami.Using "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Eric G
Dan, Sure, the very few die hards who still use newsreaders can continue participate in RAS, expect the same number of participants as you seeing now, at best. Actually much less since Google will stop hosting newsgroups starting February. It is goingto be very quiet.
Moderation does not necessarily mean content moderation, just spam control, like many Google groups and groups.io.it is done today.”
OBTP, I hope the new RAS you referring to is not yet another type of online forum which hardly anyone use. Google groups or groups.io is the way to go. I thought we already have RASPrime as a Google group?
Ramy
On Saturday, December 23, 2023 at 3:29:56 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
For the love of God, we don't need moderation! We just need adults who
can exercise the will to not read what they do not want to see.
Dan 5J
On 12/23/23 11:01, Ramy wrote:
Looks like Google found a “solution” to the problem. They removing newsgroups support all together.
“
Effective February 22, 2024, Google Groups will no longer support new Usenet content. Posting and subscribing will be disallowed, and new content from Usenet peers will not appear. Viewing and searching of historical data will still be supported as
Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
FWIW I have a feeling the reason for the sudden spams is someone started forwarding all spam’s to RAS.
We need a new moderated Google group, or groups.io. I believe very few folks still use newsreaders nowadays.
Ramy
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 5:20:25 PM UTC-8, Charles Coyne wrote: >>>> On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 1:11:17 PM UTC-8, Eric G wrote:
On 12/7/2023 7:38 AM, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:......
On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of Regulated
answer I have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS
Since I am unable to read the many foreign languages in the barrage, I'm assuming they are all hate mail, and reporting them as such rather than simple spam.I was also reporting the spam until the flood became a tsunami.Using "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Eric G
Dan, Bob, I hear ya, yet I for one (and I suspect most) , prefer one common replacement for RAS such as yahoo groups or groups.io, vs yet another forum to join and follow. It’s enough that we now have 2 web sites to follow for flight traces from ourfriends (OLC and WeGlide) I sure hope I wouldn’t need to follow 2 RAS replacements, even if I may miss some of OBTP entertainment.
For now I’ll be following RAS_Prime.going to be very quiet.
Ramy
On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 7:42:10 AM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
Ramy, I heard from a reliable source that a long time poster on RAS has
received a message from the "moderator" telling him that he shouldn't
say things that upset some folks. Now, being an "old diehard", I recall
from my youth the type who will either toss out someone whom he doesn't
like or just "take his ball and go home".
I know of a moderated email group which requires application and
approval to get in. They are word wide, have been operating for decades
and have a remarkable history to research for problem resolution. I am
a member of that group and it is knowledgeable, helpful, and polite.
Since it's an email group, there is no spam. Maybe you could set up
something like that. You could create it, get the word out, and send
invitations before google drops the hammer.
It should not be too difficult to set up an email group focused on
gliding and I wish you luck should you, or anyone else who's interested
decide to take up the challenge.
Dan 5J
On 12/23/23 16:47, Ramy wrote:
Dan, Sure, the very few die hards who still use newsreaders can continue participate in RAS, expect the same number of participants as you seeing now, at best. Actually much less since Google will stop hosting newsgroups starting February. It is
it is done today.”Moderation does not necessarily mean content moderation, just spam control, like many Google groups and groups.io.
OBTP, I hope the new RAS you referring to is not yet another type of online forum which hardly anyone use. Google groups or groups.io is the way to go. I thought we already have RASPrime as a Google group?
Ramy
On Saturday, December 23, 2023 at 3:29:56 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote: >>>> For the love of God, we don't need moderation! We just need adults who >>>> can exercise the will to not read what they do not want to see.
Dan 5J
On 12/23/23 11:01, Ramy wrote:
Looks like Google found a “solution” to the problem. They removing newsgroups support all together.
“
Effective February 22, 2024, Google Groups will no longer support new Usenet content. Posting and subscribing will be disallowed, and new content from Usenet peers will not appear. Viewing and searching of historical data will still be supported as
Regulated Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
FWIW I have a feeling the reason for the sudden spams is someone started forwarding all spam’s to RAS.
We need a new moderated Google group, or groups.io. I believe very few folks still use newsreaders nowadays.
Ramy
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 5:20:25 PM UTC-8, Charles Coyne wrote: >>>>>> On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 1:11:17 PM UTC-8, Eric G wrote: >>>>>>> On 12/7/2023 7:38 AM, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote: >>>>>>>> On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
......On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of
answer I have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS
Since I am unable to read the many foreign languages in the barrage, I'm assuming they are all hate mail, and reporting them as such rather than simple spam.I was also reporting the spam until the flood became a tsunami.Using "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Eric G
On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 2:28:44 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:our friends (OLC and WeGlide) I sure hope I wouldn’t need to follow 2 RAS replacements, even if I may miss some of OBTP entertainment.
You left out skylines.aero (:-)), a flight tracking website that I use
since I can use knots, feet, and nautical miles (the unit I have flown
with for about 51 years). They're also linked with weglide. I have
found OLC to be a real pain having to enter my wife's birth date just to
mention that she was my copilot. Seriously, what is the purpose for
demanding so much personal information?
I'd be happy to switch to another platform so long as there's nobody
with the power to tell anyone what they can or can't say.
Dan 5J
On 12/24/23 09:47, Ramy wrote:
Dan, Bob, I hear ya, yet I for one (and I suspect most) , prefer one common replacement for RAS such as yahoo groups or groups.io, vs yet another forum to join and follow. It’s enough that we now have 2 web sites to follow for flight traces from
going to be very quiet.For now I’ll be following RAS_Prime.
Ramy
On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 7:42:10 AM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
Ramy, I heard from a reliable source that a long time poster on RAS has >>>> received a message from the "moderator" telling him that he shouldn't
say things that upset some folks. Now, being an "old diehard", I recall >>>> from my youth the type who will either toss out someone whom he doesn't >>>> like or just "take his ball and go home".
I know of a moderated email group which requires application and
approval to get in. They are word wide, have been operating for decades >>>> and have a remarkable history to research for problem resolution. I am >>>> a member of that group and it is knowledgeable, helpful, and polite.
Since it's an email group, there is no spam. Maybe you could set up
something like that. You could create it, get the word out, and send
invitations before google drops the hammer.
It should not be too difficult to set up an email group focused on
gliding and I wish you luck should you, or anyone else who's interested >>>> decide to take up the challenge.
Dan 5J
On 12/23/23 16:47, Ramy wrote:
Dan, Sure, the very few die hards who still use newsreaders can continue participate in RAS, expect the same number of participants as you seeing now, at best. Actually much less since Google will stop hosting newsgroups starting February. It is
as it is done today.”Moderation does not necessarily mean content moderation, just spam control, like many Google groups and groups.io.
OBTP, I hope the new RAS you referring to is not yet another type of online forum which hardly anyone use. Google groups or groups.io is the way to go. I thought we already have RASPrime as a Google group?
Ramy
On Saturday, December 23, 2023 at 3:29:56 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote: >>>>>> For the love of God, we don't need moderation! We just need adults who >>>>>> can exercise the will to not read what they do not want to see.
Dan 5J
On 12/23/23 11:01, Ramy wrote:
Looks like Google found a “solution” to the problem. They removing newsgroups support all together.
“
Effective February 22, 2024, Google Groups will no longer support new Usenet content. Posting and subscribing will be disallowed, and new content from Usenet peers will not appear. Viewing and searching of historical data will still be supported
Regulated Goods and Services". Maybe that will carry a higher weight? Or, look to other than just "Spam".
FWIW I have a feeling the reason for the sudden spams is someone started forwarding all spam’s to RAS.
We need a new moderated Google group, or groups.io. I believe very few folks still use newsreaders nowadays.
Ramy
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 5:20:25 PM UTC-8, Charles Coyne wrote:
On Thursday, December 7, 2023 at 1:11:17 PM UTC-8, Eric G wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 12/7/2023 7:38 AM, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 10:45:07 PM UTC-5, Charlie M. (UH, Pi & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
......On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 3:49:19 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:
If you can make it through all of that, well, they you can avoid sending in a paper Bill of Sale, Application for Aircraft Registration, and a check.
For those wanting to see if something can be done by reporting the spamming, try selecting the box top left to "select all on the page". Scroll down and uncheck any that are real, then, instead of "Report as Spam", select "Promotion of
answer I have seen, but why should I not expect it from Google? So good at some things, worthless as a wind driven generator on a calm night on so many other things.
Now, to really dream big, once I have reported it, Dear Google Group Viewer, can you please just hide it, and not show a place holder for it saying "This conversation is hidden because you reported it for abuse." That is the most useless POS
fantastic no participant would ever get a call from a moderator telling the individual that he dislike Santa Clause post even if he doesn't fly a motorglider. I use the term moderator only because it is the term most associated with forum control orDan and Ramy, I will tell you with confidence that there will be NO limiting what people can say! There will be a section called the Octagon, where you can voice dislike with many topics and discussions. I belong to a couple such forums and they areSince I am unable to read the many foreign languages in the barrage, I'm assuming they are all hate mail, and reporting them as such rather than simple spam.I was also reporting the spam until the flood became a tsunami. >>>>>>>>> Eric GUsing "mass method", I just...Steve, I like your "mass method" of reporting the spam. I was happy to see the blue stop sign on a thread and click that....saved some steps over reporting 1 by 1.
Steve Leonard
Well, I just spent the time to report over 1200 threads as "spam" or "other". In that, there were 3(?) valid threads for this group.
Oh, and it got me to 11/29/23
Merry Christmas, and Santa would never fly a motorglider!
| Sysop: | Keyop |
|---|---|
| Location: | Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, UK |
| Users: | 715 |
| Nodes: | 16 (2 / 14) |
| Uptime: | 35:01:48 |
| Calls: | 12,109 |
| Files: | 15,006 |
| Messages: | 6,518,345 |