• Good thing he had an EJECTION seat in his motor glider.

    From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jul 15 01:09:27 2023
  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jul 15 02:58:33 2023
    And that was from the NTSB. In this case it was the press that got it right.

    https://ktvl.com/news/local/glider-crashes-in-rural-washington-county-pilot-able-to-parachute-out-roy-road-sheriffs-office-cornelius-metro-west-oregon

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 15 04:10:03 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist

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  • From Hank Nixon@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 15 05:45:12 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 7:10:05 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist

    Doesn't sound like it has anything to do with motor .
    UH

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Hank Nixon on Sat Jul 15 07:04:28 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 8:45:15 AM UTC-4, Hank Nixon wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 7:10:05 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist
    Doesn't sound like it has anything to do with motor .
    UH


    Well at least he didn't kill the tow pilot.

    Walt Connelly

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  • From Craig Reinholt@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jul 15 07:05:38 2023
    Doesn't sound like it has anything to do with motor .
    UH
    Correct Hank. Per the pilot, he took a tow to 3000'. Practiced some stalls. Cycled the engine up and down in flight. Entered a right turn to head back to the gliderport IP and spun it. Spiral dive ensued. Wing came off when pulling out of the dive. The
    parachute opened very close to the ground. He normally didn't wear a chute, but his CFIG convinced him recently to begin that practice.
    As usual, Bob "stirs the pot" without any info.
    Craig

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  • From jfitch@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 15 09:12:56 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:10:05 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist
    Bob, as anyone who flies a motorglider knows, you must be very careful pushing the right rudder pedal. The presence of an engine has a neuro-psychic effect on the brain due to gravity waves emanating from its mass, making the right foot stronger. This
    leads to skidding turns when turning right. To counteract this, I ALWAYS turn left. Another contributing factor in this case is that the AC-5M Russia is not pretty enough to actually fly. I avoid calling it "ugly" since beauty is in the eye of the
    beholder and I don't want to offend any owners.

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  • From Dan Marotta@21:1/5 to jfitch on Sat Jul 15 11:36:57 2023
    The propeller on the Stemme rotates counter clockwise as viewed from the
    pilot seat but I don't notice any particular rudder need on takeoff.
    Maybe it's the distance between the main gear and tail wheel or maybe
    it's just those damned cross winds that keep the feet working to make
    the thing go straight.

    Dan
    5J

    On 7/15/23 10:12, jfitch wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:10:05 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote: >>> https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist
    Bob, as anyone who flies a motorglider knows, you must be very careful pushing the right rudder pedal. The presence of an engine has a neuro-psychic effect on the brain due to gravity waves emanating from its mass, making the right foot stronger. This
    leads to skidding turns when turning right. To counteract this, I ALWAYS turn left. Another contributing factor in this case is that the AC-5M Russia is not pretty enough to actually fly. I avoid calling it "ugly" since beauty is in the eye of the
    beholder and I don't want to offend any owners.

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to jfitch on Sat Jul 15 16:27:27 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 12:12:59 PM UTC-4, jfitch wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:10:05 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 4:09:29 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/Aviation/ReportMain/GenerateNewestReport/192533/pdf?fbclid=IwAR2PBlWN_9pwVl-LKLpECy_CRZxXdOAkHrEkhyoAaBdTzx4glTdA5WIiD1E
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship? Hey Fitch, what the heck is going on with all these motorglider crashes? Old Bob. The Purist
    Bob, as anyone who flies a motorglider knows, you must be very careful pushing the right rudder pedal. The presence of an engine has a neuro-psychic effect on the brain due to gravity waves emanating from its mass, making the right foot stronger. This
    leads to skidding turns when turning right. To counteract this, I ALWAYS turn left. Another contributing factor in this case is that the AC-5M Russia is not pretty enough to actually fly. I avoid calling it "ugly" since beauty is in the eye of the
    beholder and I don't want to offend any owners.
    Fitch, I think you are on to something with the neuro-psychic effect on the brain. The motor rotated the opposite direction just like the Pitts model12 and must have had something to do with the unusual spin and then the pilot got the motorglider into a
    spiral and yanked the wing off prior to ejecting. The conclusion would probably concur that one should not buy a Russian motorglider, and yes, they are pretty ugly. Craig, pay close attention, you might just learn something. Old Bob, The Purist

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Craig Reinholt on Sat Jul 15 18:01:12 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 8:25:10 PM UTC-4, Craig Reinholt wrote:
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention
    as well.
    Now Craig, the following scenario was probably the culprit. As the Motorglider pilot was busy screwing with the engine, he was distracted and very uncoordinated which resulted in the initial spin. Not being aware of spin recovery the motorglider pilot
    let the motorglider get into a spiral and therefore pulled the wing off in an attempt to gain control, we call that , screwing up, down here in the South. It is not the first nor the last time that this type of accident has occurred, I do remember an
    ASW27 that went from a spin to a spiral and resulted in a fatal accident. The question is why was the pilot screwing with the up and down and not running the motor on the motorglider??? I will let you speculate on that. Old Bob, The Purist

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  • From Craig Reinholt@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jul 15 17:25:07 2023
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention as
    well.

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  • From jfitch@21:1/5 to Craig Reinholt on Sat Jul 15 17:59:39 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 5:25:10 PM UTC-7, Craig Reinholt wrote:
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention
    as well.
    It has nothing to do with the engine running, just the mass of it causes the neuro-psychic effect twitching the right foot. More so on people in Florida, but can affect those launching from Trump voting counties in Oregon as well.

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  • From Eric Greenwell@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 15 21:14:12 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 2:58:36 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    And that was from the NTSB. In this case it was the press that got it right.

    https://ktvl.com/news/local/glider-crashes-in-rural-washington-county-pilot-able-to-parachute-out-roy-road-sheriffs-office-cornelius-metro-west-oregon
    The articles barely give enough information to make very speculative guesses about what happened. If only we knew the pilot's experience in gliders, his time in motorgliders, recency of experience, and his time in the AC4/AC5 gliders.

    My wild speculation is this was his first flight in the AC5, he had no prior experience in motorgliders, did not read my Guide, and is a low-time pilot.

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to jfitch on Sun Jul 16 03:39:50 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 8:59:41 PM UTC-4, jfitch wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 5:25:10 PM UTC-7, Craig Reinholt wrote:
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention
    as well.
    It has nothing to do with the engine running, just the mass of it causes the neuro-psychic effect twitching the right foot. More so on people in Florida, but can affect those launching from Trump voting counties in Oregon as well.
    Fitch, it is another Russian Dossier, more false information that may result in Comey being the main investigator and the FISA court issuing a request for the damaged glider. OBTP

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  • From Moshe Braner@21:1/5 to Eric Greenwell on Sun Jul 16 09:26:22 2023
    On 7/16/2023 12:14 AM, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 2:58:36 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    And that was from the NTSB. In this case it was the press that got it right. >>
    https://ktvl.com/news/local/glider-crashes-in-rural-washington-county-pilot-able-to-parachute-out-roy-road-sheriffs-office-cornelius-metro-west-oregon
    The articles barely give enough information to make very speculative guesses about what happened. If only we knew the pilot's experience in gliders, his time in motorgliders, recency of experience, and his time in the AC4/AC5 gliders.

    My wild speculation is this was his first flight in the AC5, he had no prior experience in motorgliders, did not read my Guide, and is a low-time pilot.


    I've owned the AC4 for the last 12 years and flown it hundreds of hours.
    It has behaved nicely, never got anywhere close to a spin. If I get
    too slow in a thermal it obviously shudders but does not drop a wing. I
    don't know if the AC5 (similar, but with the motor) is different. One
    thing that comes to mind: was the CG in range? Since I myself don't
    weigh much, I look at that very carefully. I have 18 pounds of lead
    installed in the front cockpit. That puts the CG in the range. Just
    barely, but the stability results seem fine.

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  • From jfitch@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sun Jul 16 08:07:53 2023
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:01:14 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 8:25:10 PM UTC-4, Craig Reinholt wrote:
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention
    as well.
    Now Craig, the following scenario was probably the culprit. As the Motorglider pilot was busy screwing with the engine, he was distracted and very uncoordinated which resulted in the initial spin. Not being aware of spin recovery the motorglider pilot
    let the motorglider get into a spiral and therefore pulled the wing off in an attempt to gain control, we call that , screwing up, down here in the South. It is not the first nor the last time that this type of accident has occurred, I do remember an
    ASW27 that went from a spin to a spiral and resulted in a fatal accident. The question is why was the pilot screwing with the up and down and not running the motor on the motorglider??? I will let you speculate on that. Old Bob, The Purist
    Bob, no doubt the motor in the ASW27 was the cause of that spin accident as well.

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  • From John Sinclair@21:1/5 to Moshe Braner on Sun Jul 16 08:01:17 2023
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 6:26:29 AM UTC-7, Moshe Braner wrote:
    On 7/16/2023 12:14 AM, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 2:58:36 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    And that was from the NTSB. In this case it was the press that got it right.

    https://ktvl.com/news/local/glider-crashes-in-rural-washington-county-pilot-able-to-parachute-out-roy-road-sheriffs-office-cornelius-metro-west-oregon
    The articles barely give enough information to make very speculative guesses about what happened. If only we knew the pilot's experience in gliders, his time in motorgliders, recency of experience, and his time in the AC4/AC5 gliders.

    My wild speculation is this was his first flight in the AC5, he had no prior experience in motorgliders, did not read my Guide, and is a low-time pilot.

    I've owned the AC4 for the last 12 years and flown it hundreds of hours.
    It has behaved nicely, never got anywhere close to a spin. If I get
    too slow in a thermal it obviously shudders but does not drop a wing. I don't know if the AC5 (similar, but with the motor) is different. One
    thing that comes to mind: was the CG in range? Since I myself don't
    weigh much, I look at that very carefully. I have 18 pounds of lead installed in the front cockpit. That puts the CG in the range. Just
    barely, but the stability results seem fine.



    Very good point concerning the Russia motor glider, center of gravity, Moshe! Adding considerable weight ( motor, prop, fuel, etc) behind the CG would definitely require more weight in the cockpit to keep the ship within the published CG range!
    This accident has first flight in a motor glider written all over it? Pilot heard a loud BANG, as he retracted the motor! Was the prop centered, before retracting it? The bang was probably the sound of the prop striking the sides of the engine bay? CG
    shifts aft when the engine is retracted, if the pilot didn’t weigh enough to make the minimum pilot weight ………………….. you fill in the rest!
    Glad to see he survived via parachute,
    JJ

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  • From Dan Marotta@21:1/5 to jfitch on Sun Jul 16 13:47:53 2023
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?

    Dan
    5J

    On 7/16/23 09:07, jfitch wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 6:01:14 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 15, 2023 at 8:25:10 PM UTC-4, Craig Reinholt wrote:
    Interesting theories, but since the engine was retracted into the fuselage and the airframe was "clean" before the right hand turn that ended up in a spin, the engine had no causality on the resulting crash. I guess others should pay closer attention
    as well.
    Now Craig, the following scenario was probably the culprit. As the Motorglider pilot was busy screwing with the engine, he was distracted and very uncoordinated which resulted in the initial spin. Not being aware of spin recovery the motorglider pilot
    let the motorglider get into a spiral and therefore pulled the wing off in an attempt to gain control, we call that , screwing up, down here in the South. It is not the first nor the last time that this type of accident has occurred, I do remember an
    ASW27 that went from a spin to a spiral and resulted in a fatal accident. The question is why was the pilot screwing with the up and down and not running the motor on the motorglider??? I will let you speculate on that. Old Bob, The Purist
    Bob, no doubt the motor in the ASW27 was the cause of that spin accident as well.

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  • From Mark628CA@21:1/5 to Dan Marotta on Sun Jul 16 14:17:18 2023
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?

    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jul 16 16:14:01 2023
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe, oh
    well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist

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  • From Ramy@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sun Jul 16 18:56:43 2023
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such incident.
    Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy

    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe, oh
    well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist

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  • From Dan Daly@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Mon Jul 17 07:55:23 2023
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 10:42:30 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP

    I agree with Ramy. Discussion of flight safety incidents/accidents are serious, and not the place for "a few laughs and short jabs".

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Ramy on Mon Jul 17 07:42:27 2023
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such incident.
    Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe, oh
    well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Dan Daly on Mon Jul 17 11:17:53 2023
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 10:55:26 AM UTC-4, Dan Daly wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 10:42:30 AM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    I agree with Ramy. Discussion of flight safety incidents/accidents are serious, and not the place for "a few laughs and short jabs".
    Dan, there is nothing here that takes away from the serious aspects of the event! Everyone is entitled to their opinions and postings, sorry that you don't see it that way. There are many comments referencing the event that are humorous, they are also
    teachable moments contained within. Bob

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jul 17 15:36:11 2023
    discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    I agree with Ramy. Discussion of flight safety incidents/accidents are serious, and not the place for "a few laughs and short jabs".
    Dan, there is nothing here that takes away from the serious aspects of the event! Everyone is entitled to their opinions and postings, sorry that you don't see it that way. There are many comments referencing the event that are humorous, they are also
    teachable moments contained within. Bob

    I'm sure the injured pilot is enjoying the "few laughs and short jabs" he was able to supply with his accident.

    Steve

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Tue Jul 18 02:27:15 2023
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 6:36:14 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    I agree with Ramy. Discussion of flight safety incidents/accidents are serious, and not the place for "a few laughs and short jabs".
    Dan, there is nothing here that takes away from the serious aspects of the event! Everyone is entitled to their opinions and postings, sorry that you don't see it that way. There are many comments referencing the event that are humorous, they are
    also teachable moments contained within. Bob
    I'm sure the injured pilot is enjoying the "few laughs and short jabs" he was able to supply with his accident.

    Steve
    Hopefully so Steve, a few laughs will go a long way. OBTP

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  • From 2G@21:1/5 to Ramy on Tue Jul 18 21:20:53 2023
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 6:56:46 PM UTC-7, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such incident.
    Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe, oh
    well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist

    Ramy, let this be a lesson when you try to be serious with Booby. I wonder if there is a dementia test now when you get a 3rd class medical?

    Tom 2G

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  • From Charles Longley@21:1/5 to All on Tue Jul 18 21:57:28 2023
    On Tuesday, July 18, 2023 at 9:20:56 PM UTC-7, 2G wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 6:56:46 PM UTC-7, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe,
    oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Ramy, let this be a lesson when you try to be serious with Booby. I wonder if there is a dementia test now when you get a 3rd class medical?

    Tom 2G
    You should take the dementia test Tommy.

    I was sitting in the bar tonight with my first officer who happens to be a glider pilot with no cross country experience. He asked me well what about getting a motor glider? I said why don't I cut my penis off and change my sex. He thought that was
    pretty funny!

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  • From Eric Greenwell@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Wed Jul 19 16:46:04 2023
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe,
    oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Eric Greenwell on Thu Jul 20 03:42:37 2023
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to believe,
    oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to All on Thu Jul 20 19:21:10 2023
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP


    [email protected]
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship?


    Not directed at Eric?

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Thu Jul 20 19:31:12 2023
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 10:21:13 PM UTC-4, [email protected] wrote:
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    [email protected]
    I was just wondering of Eric help assemble the ship?
    Not directed at Eric?
    So what is so offensive about that , the assembly was documented and a video was taken. After all it was Eric that made the comment that the pilot should have read his book, I will let you explain that reply. OBTP

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  • From Eric Greenwell@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 22 14:15:20 2023
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to
    believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...

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    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Eric Greenwell on Sat Jul 22 14:58:01 2023
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to
    believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP

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  • From Eric Greenwell@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Sat Jul 22 20:26:02 2023
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from such
    incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to
    believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you free."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Eric Greenwell on Wed Aug 2 10:25:30 2023
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 11:26:04 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from
    such incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard to
    believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you free."
    Eric, I don't think that reading some type of rag sheet would have helped James, hopefully he is recovering and doing well. OBTP

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  • From Eric Greenwell@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Wed Aug 2 12:55:17 2023
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 10:25:32 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 11:26:04 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn from
    such incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is hard
    to believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you free."
    Eric, I don't think that reading some type of rag sheet would have helped James, hopefully he is recovering and doing well. OBTP
    This is what I and others try to tell you: you make disparaging judgements without knowledge. In this case, it's the "rag sheet" remark from you, even though you have not read the Guide, or if he did read it.

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  • From Hank Nixon@21:1/5 to Eric Greenwell on Wed Aug 2 14:13:57 2023
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 3:55:19 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 10:25:32 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 11:26:04 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn
    from such incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is
    hard to believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you free."
    Eric, I don't think that reading some type of rag sheet would have helped James, hopefully he is recovering and doing well. OBTP
    This is what I and others try to tell you: you make disparaging judgements without knowledge. In this case, it's the "rag sheet" remark from you, even though you have not read the Guide, or if he did read it.


    The Guide has a lot of very useful information.
    Bob, my friend, sometimes you just go too far.
    I know a lot is tongue in cheek, but it would be good to turn the temperature down.
    Failure to do so means folks won't pay attention to the good and constructive things you say.
    UH

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  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to Hank Nixon on Wed Aug 2 15:33:24 2023
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 5:13:59 PM UTC-4, Hank Nixon wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 3:55:19 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 10:25:32 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 11:26:04 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn
    from such incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is
    hard to believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you free.
    "
    Eric, I don't think that reading some type of rag sheet would have helped James, hopefully he is recovering and doing well. OBTP
    This is what I and others try to tell you: you make disparaging judgements without knowledge. In this case, it's the "rag sheet" remark from you, even though you have not read the Guide, or if he did read it.
    The Guide has a lot of very useful information.
    Bob, my friend, sometimes you just go too far.
    I know a lot is tongue in cheek, but it would be good to turn the temperature down.
    Failure to do so means folks won't pay attention to the good and constructive things you say.
    UH
    UH, sorry that offense was taken in me making reference to the motorglider guide as the, "Rag Sheet", by definition the meaning simply states that it is paper made from rags, usually cotton. Hank, you guys are wound way too tight, loosen up and have a
    bit of fun. Now old Bob, The Purist will be away for a few days, certainly not vacationing or flying my pure glider, but hopefully returning very soon to turn the heat up on the RAS motorglider guys. Take care, OBTP

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From 2G@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Wed Aug 2 20:12:30 2023
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 3:33:27 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 5:13:59 PM UTC-4, Hank Nixon wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 3:55:19 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Wednesday, August 2, 2023 at 10:25:32 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 11:26:04 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 2:58:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 5:15:23 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Thursday, July 20, 2023 at 3:42:40 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 19, 2023 at 7:46:07 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
    On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 7:42:30 AM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 9:56:46 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
    Reading this thread, I find a report on a serious incident resulted from spin which developed into spiral, with the pilot alive thanks to recently deciding to take emergency parachutes seriously. There are important lessons to learn
    from such incident. Why was the spin developed into spiral dive? Pilot error? Aft CG? Good discussion on it.
    Yet mixed in this thread are jokes about motorgliders, which only confusing some of the readers who apparently not read the whole thread or Craig’s report.
    Common folks, this is a serious incident, let’s pay more attention to the facts reported and keep the jokes to other motorglider threads. Just sayin…

    Ramy
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:14:03 PM UTC-7, [email protected] wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 5:17:21 PM UTC-4, Mark628CA wrote:
    On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 1:47:58 PM UTC-6, Dan Marotta wrote:
    I had no idea there was an ASW-27 with an engine installation. Is it a
    self-launcher or a sustainer?
    The only engine installation on an ASW-27 I know of is Chris Esselstyne's twin-engine turbojet project. It is a self-launcher. (You might have seen it at Moriarty last year.)
    Mark, that ship needs DQ as a contest number, Drag Queen. I cannot believe that Craig would think of me as stirring the pot, that really hurt. I have been so kind to the Motorglider guys and to have such an insult thrown my way is
    hard to believe, oh well, it is what it is! Old Bob, The Purist
    Loosen up Ramy, nothing here offensive to anyone, just a few laughs and short jabs. OBTP
    Some of it is offensive to me. I agree with Ramy.
    If something is not directed at you, then how are you offended? What you should do is write a new book titled, "Motorgliders For Dummies". OBTP
    Have you read my "Guide"? It's not admitting you are a dummy if you have read it...
    No, I have not, rather spend time reading something interesting like, "The National Enquirer". OBTP
    Someone that is considering a motorglider, explains them to others, and disparages motorglider pilots, but hasn't read the "Guide" ... you just might be a Dummy. "Sometimes what you are most afraid of doing is the one thing that will set you
    free."
    Eric, I don't think that reading some type of rag sheet would have helped James, hopefully he is recovering and doing well. OBTP
    This is what I and others try to tell you: you make disparaging judgements without knowledge. In this case, it's the "rag sheet" remark from you, even though you have not read the Guide, or if he did read it.
    The Guide has a lot of very useful information.
    Bob, my friend, sometimes you just go too far.
    I know a lot is tongue in cheek, but it would be good to turn the temperature down.
    Failure to do so means folks won't pay attention to the good and constructive things you say.
    UH
    UH, sorry that offense was taken in me making reference to the motorglider guide as the, "Rag Sheet", by definition the meaning simply states that it is paper made from rags, usually cotton. Hank, you guys are wound way too tight, loosen up and have a
    bit of fun. Now old Bob, The Purist will be away for a few days, certainly not vacationing or flying my pure glider, but hopefully returning very soon to turn the heat up on the RAS motorglider guys. Take care, OBTP

    That is the BEST thing that I have heard from Boobie in a long time.

    Tom 2G

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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