• The Horner affair

    From Sir Tim@21:1/5 to All on Sun Feb 11 14:37:18 2024
    “According to some sources the complaints against Christian Horner are not
    of a sexual nature but more about Horner's supposed aggressive and
    controlling management style.”

    Has any team manager ever been successful without being “aggressive and controlling”?



    --
    Sir Tim

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  • From Mark Jackson@21:1/5 to Sir Tim on Sun Feb 11 10:52:22 2024
    On 2/11/2024 9:37 AM, Sir Tim wrote:
    “According to some sources the complaints against Christian Horner
    are not of a sexual nature but more about Horner's supposed
    aggressive and controlling management style.”

    Has any team manager ever been successful without being “aggressive
    and controlling”?

    Probably not, although (for example) beating staff about the head and
    shoulders while shouting "No wire hangers! No wire hangers ever!" would
    almost certainly be considered unacceptable. There's a line short of
    that somewhere.

    --
    Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
    I have tried to bring scientific thinking to literary
    criticism, and there's been very little gratitude for this.
    - Kurt Vonnegut

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  • From geoff@21:1/5 to Sir Tim on Mon Feb 12 19:43:33 2024
    On 12/02/2024 3:37 am, Sir Tim wrote:
    “According to some sources the complaints against Christian Horner are not of a sexual nature but more about Horner's supposed aggressive and controlling management style.”

    Has any team manager ever been successful without being “aggressive and controlling”?




    Maybe more like "some team managers have been successful despite being aggressive and controlling".

    geoff

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  • From Yazoo@21:1/5 to Sir Tim on Mon Feb 12 08:47:49 2024
    On 11 Feb 2024 14:37:18 GMT, Sir Tim <[email protected]d> wrote:

    “According to some sources the complaints against Christian Horner are not >of a sexual nature but more about Horner's supposed aggressive and >controlling management style.”

    Has any team manager ever been successful without being “aggressive and >controlling”?

    We don't know about him, but for example Ron Dennis was notoriously
    hard on his people. Times has changed, and hes management style would
    be questioned today.

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  • From geoff@21:1/5 to Martin Harran on Tue Feb 13 16:13:49 2024
    On 13/02/2024 12:10 am, Martin Harran wrote:
    On 11 Feb 2024 14:37:18 GMT, Sir Tim <[email protected]d> wrote:

    “According to some sources the complaints against Christian Horner are not >> of a sexual nature but more about Horner's supposed aggressive and
    controlling management style.”

    Has any team manager ever been successful without being “aggressive and
    controlling”?


    Rebecca Clancy had a good article in yesterday;s Sunday Times about
    her 7 years covering F1 for the paper: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/roaring-egos-and-track-titans-my-life-in-the-formula-one-fast-lane-pckhf8xrj

    Unfortunately, it's paywalled but here are some extracts:

    "The allegations against Horner have put the spotlight on what life is
    like in the paddock, revealing that it is not just the finishing flags
    that are chequered. Horner is known to be a hard taskmaster. One of
    his employees told me he is laser-focused on presenteeism.

    When most teams land back at headquarters, many staff go home. But Red
    Bull is known to require its staff to go into the office, no matter
    where they have flown in from. Perhaps unsurprisingly the team has a
    high staff turnover.

    […]

    One of the reasons Horner is paid a reported £8 million a year is
    because he is brilliant at marketing - both himself and Red Bull. His marriage to Geri Halliwell, the former Spice Girl, has added to his
    fame and combined the pair are thought to be worth £80 million. The
    pair have three children between them and a wi-fi password of
    "Wonderful Husband".

    Horner has rarely met a camera he doesn't like and his "big man in the
    pit lane" shtick has flourished in front of Netflix's lenses. His rift
    with Toto Wolff, the Mercedes team principal, bordered on the
    ridiculous in 2021, their war of words escalating with every race.
    Then it turned out that Drive to Survive was filming it all and
    suddenly their behaviour began to make more sense.

    I have written negatively about both Wolff and Horner but I believe I
    have always been fair. Both can be prickly if they don't like what you
    write or a question you ask. Each is hugely successful because they
    demand the best from people and hold them to high standards. That can
    cause friction and tension but that's also part of the job. When I was pregnant with my second child and clearly showing, Wolff saw me and
    walked across the paddock to congratulate me. Horner was equally kind.

    [...]

    With Wolff and Horner to the fore, Drive to Survive has transformed
    the sport, turning already famous and powerful figures into
    superstars, turbocharging egos and boosting the melodrama. There is no
    doubt that it has been phenomenal for the popularity of F1, with one
    survey finding that half of the fans who watch the sport had come to
    it through the show.

    But Drive to Survive has also been jet fuel to the egos in the sport,
    who can often be found trying to get in front of the cameras,
    showboating or talking about which episode they were in.

    […]

    The celebs flit in and out but the paddock is always a hotbed of
    gossip. Clearly Horner's fate is in the balance and if he loses his
    job, this will undoubtedly have repercussions in the sport.

    But it is also the case that F1 will always attract big egos, machismo
    and tough characters. Driving at 200mph millimetres from a concrete
    wall is bonkers, much as the drivers tell me they love it. Despite all
    the strains and pressures of the pit lane, I will miss it greatly.

    Maybe he drinks a bit too much ..... Red Bull !

    geoff

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  • From Andrew Smallshaw@21:1/5 to Martin Harran on Wed Feb 14 23:09:58 2024
    On 2024-02-12, Martin Harran <[email protected]> wrote:

    Horner has rarely met a camera he doesn't like and his "big man in the
    pit lane" shtick has flourished in front of Netflix's lenses. His rift

    I don't know, I recall seeing him not long after DC retired. DC
    was doing a piece to camera and Horner made sure to get in frame
    before blowing a raspberry at him - this was early morning on race
    day. DC didn't skip a beat. Horner was assuming it was a pre-prepared
    piece to camera and wondering why he hadn't responded immediately.

    It became clear a few seconds later when DC shoved the microphone
    in his direction. "Christian Horner, head of Red Bull, we're LIVE
    on the BBC news channel..." and proceeded with an ad hoc mini-interview.

    The look on his face was priceless...

    As for the allegations I don't know, neither do you and speculation
    will probably do more harm than good. I've always tried to avoid
    having staff under me (more trouble than they're worth) but have
    had to instruct more junior staff in the past as part of what I
    was doing. It does depend on the individual, sometimes it's
    listening to concerns and explaining why it is you want things done
    in a particular way. Other people will object as a matter of habit
    and I've used the metaphorical big stick, "THIS is what I want you
    do and THAT is how you are going do it."

    --
    Andrew Smallshaw
    [email protected]

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