• Re: Robert Creeley poem

    From HarryLime@21:1/5 to W.Dockery on Wed Feb 19 18:53:55 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka
    "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here.
    Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I
    was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line
    of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be
    something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing
    such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.

    The poem hasn't done anything, Donkey.

    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism (and his
    subsequent offensive misogynistic personal attacks) that have caused all
    the trouble.

    Mr. Creeley's poem is innocent of all charges.

    --

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  • From HarryLime@21:1/5 to W.Dockery on Wed Feb 19 19:39:53 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka
    "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here.
    Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing
    such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.


    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance poem again, he didn't make an accusation, just an observation.

    It wasn't a poem, Donkey, it was a post.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."

    --

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  • From George J. Dance@21:1/5 to W.Dockery on Thu Feb 20 12:51:34 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 20:49:25 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here. >>>>>>> Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.


    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance post again, he didn't make an accusation, just an
    observation.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    No, George Dance made the observation, see below.

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be
    something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."

    --

    No, George Dance was saying that's what" they," Nancy Gene would call
    it.

    Are you just playing stupid again or is your reading comprehension
    really that poor?

    You're being too charitable, Will. You left out a third possibility,
    which looks like the most likely. Let's review them:

    (1) HarryLiar is a troll, and he's only pretending to have misunderstood
    the line.
    (2) HarryLiar is a stupid drunk, and did misunderstand the line.
    (3) HarryLiar is a troll, and understood the line; but he pretended to misunderstand it, so that he could convince NastyGoon to return to aapc
    and do backup flaming for him.

    Personally, considering what's happened since, I'm going for option (3).
    😏

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  • From HarryLime@21:1/5 to W.Dockery on Thu Feb 20 13:03:07 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 20:49:25 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here. >>>>>>> Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.


    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance post again, he didn't make an accusation, just an
    observation.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    No, George Dance made the observation, see below.

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be
    something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."

    --

    No, George Dance was saying that's what" they," Nancy Gene would call
    it.

    Are you just playing stupid again or is your reading comprehension
    really that poor?

    How does that matter, Donkey?

    If the line had been copied from Creeley with only minor modifications
    (as George Dance falsely claims), posting it without crediting him
    *would* be plagiarism.

    It doesn't matter whether NancyGene would call it "plagiarism" if
    someone else did it. It would be an act of plagiarism regardless of
    what NancyGene, or anyone else, called it.

    And since George Dance titled the thread this accusation appeared in
    "NastyGoon lifts a line" (FYI: That is a direct accusation that
    NancyGene copied the line from Creeley), he's calling her a
    plagiarist... twice.

    -- Michael Pendragon

    “Yes, the poem itself is based on a dress I had 43 years ago.
    May 8th 1982 to be exact.” – Will “I’m a Lumberjack” Donkey

    --

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  • From George J. Dance@21:1/5 to HarryLime on Thu Feb 20 13:33:20 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Thu, 20 Feb 2025 13:03:02 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 20:49:25 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were >>>>>>>> intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here. >>>>>>>> Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>>>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.

    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance post again, he didn't make an accusation, just an >>>> observation.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    No, George Dance made the observation, see below.

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."


    No, George Dance was saying that's what" they," Nancy Gene would call
    it.

    Are you just playing stupid again or is your reading comprehension
    really that poor?

    How does that matter, Donkey?

    If the line had been copied from Creeley with only minor modifications
    (as George Dance falsely claims), posting it without crediting him
    *would* be plagiarism.

    No, Lying Michael. Copying one line of someone else's poem to use in a
    poem of one's own is not plagiarism. It may be considered rude, if done
    to a living author, but it is not considered literary theft.

    It doesn't matter whether NancyGene would call it "plagiarism" if
    someone else did it. It would be an act of plagiarism regardless of
    what NancyGene, or anyone else, called it.

    No, Lying Michael: it's something that only a troll would call
    plagiarism: a troll like NastyGoon, or ... yourself.

    And since George Dance titled the thread this accusation appeared in "NastyGoon lifts a line" (FYI: That is a direct accusation that
    NancyGene copied the line from Creeley), he's calling her a
    plagiarist... twice.

    No, HarryLiar. As Will said, you got the line wrong. The only question
    is why.

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  • From HarryLime@21:1/5 to George J. Dance on Thu Feb 20 15:38:41 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Thu, 20 Feb 2025 13:33:17 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    On Thu, 20 Feb 2025 13:03:02 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 20:49:25 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were >>>>>>>>> intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here. >>>>>>>>> Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I
    was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be
    something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>>>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.

    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance post again, he didn't make an accusation, just an >>>>> observation.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    No, George Dance made the observation, see below.

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."


    No, George Dance was saying that's what" they," Nancy Gene would call
    it.

    Are you just playing stupid again or is your reading comprehension
    really that poor?

    How does that matter, Donkey?

    If the line had been copied from Creeley with only minor modifications
    (as George Dance falsely claims), posting it without crediting him
    *would* be plagiarism.

    No, Lying Michael. Copying one line of someone else's poem to use in a
    poem of one's own is not plagiarism. It may be considered rude, if done
    to a living author, but it is not considered literary theft.

    It doesn't matter whether NancyGene would call it "plagiarism" if
    someone else did it. It would be an act of plagiarism regardless of
    what NancyGene, or anyone else, called it.

    No, Lying Michael: it's something that only a troll would call
    plagiarism: a troll like NastyGoon, or ... yourself.

    And since George Dance titled the thread this accusation appeared in
    "NastyGoon lifts a line" (FYI: That is a direct accusation that
    NancyGene copied the line from Creeley), he's calling her a
    plagiarist... twice.

    No, HarryLiar. As Will said, you got the line wrong. The only question
    is why.

    Wrong again, George.

    Stealing a line of poetry from another author and attempting to pass it
    off as your own is an act of plagiarism. It may or may not be the type
    of plagiarism I could be taken to court over (I don't pretend to be a
    lawyer), but it is still by definition "plagiarism."

    Let's look at the definition of "Plagiarize" at Merriam-Webster:

    transitive verb

    : to steal and pass off (the ideas or words of another) as one's own :
    use (another's production) without crediting the source

    intransitive verb

    : to commit literary theft : present as new and original an idea or
    product derived from an existing source

    Stealing a line of poetry would be included under both of these
    definitions.

    --

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  • From HarryLime@21:1/5 to George J. Dance on Thu Feb 20 18:51:56 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Thu, 20 Feb 2025 18:22:17 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here. >>>>>>> Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.


    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance poem again, he didn't make an accusation, just an
    observation.

    It wasn't a poem, Donkey, it was a post.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    Wrong. As the quoted lines make clear, I'd said it was something that an ignorant fool ("Dr. NastyGoon being my example) would call "plagiarism":

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be
    something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."

    Your accusation does not make this clear, duplicitous George.

    Even if one believes that your use of the childish name "NastyGoon" was intended to imply "an ignorant fool," such a reading would make your
    sentence incomprehensible:

    "I do hope [an ignorant fool] credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would
    be something they would call, you know -- 'plagiarism.'"

    Are you saying that one would have to be an ignorant fool to credit
    Creeley? That's what your sentence would be saying if one makes the substitution.

    The truth is that you've libeled NancyGene by falsely accusing her of plagiarism, and the prospect that she could sue the pants off of you has
    got you shaking in your boots and desperately doing everything in your
    possible to backtrack.

    Even in light of the psychological trauma you undergo at the thought of
    having your pants removed, your behavior is inexcusable.

    Just man up and apologize already (and you can throw in a second apology
    for all the misogynistic sh*t you been spewing, like "cunt."

    --

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  • From George J. Dance@21:1/5 to HarryLime on Thu Feb 20 18:22:25 2025
    XPost: alt.arts.poetry.comments

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 19:39:48 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:57:09 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 18:53:52 +0000, HarryLime wrote:

    On Wed, 19 Feb 2025 6:41:33 +0000, Will Dockery wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Feb 2025 0:04:15 +0000, George J. Dance wrote:

    https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article.php?id=255731&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments
    On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 16:15:27 +0000, Michael Monkey Peabrain (MPP) aka >>>>> "HarryLime" wrote:

    I realized from the content of NancyGene's posts that they were
    intelligent, well-educated, and better written than anyone here.
    Naturally, I asked them to start contributing to the "Sampler." And I >>>>>> was right in doing so.

    Here are the opening lines of NancyGene's latest poem:

    "Yesterdays stack up like piles of read newspapers,
    Cluttering my mind and obstructing my day."

    That's poetry of the highest quality.

    The opening line is very good. It's almost as good as the opening line >>>>> of Robert Creeleys poem, "The Days Pile Up":

    "The days pile up like unread newspapers,"

    I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be >>>>> something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism".

    Ping Rachel:

    This is the obert Creeley poem I was telling you about, the one causing >>>> such a ruckus here on the poetry newsgroup.


    It's George Dance's libelous accusation of plagiarism

    Read the George Dance poem again, he didn't make an accusation, just an
    observation.

    It wasn't a poem, Donkey, it was a post.

    And, yes, George Dance did make the accusation:

    Wrong. As the quoted lines make clear, I'd said it was something that an ignorant fool ("Dr. NastyGoon being my example) would call "plagiarism":

    "I do hope "Dr." NastyGoon credited Mr. Creeley; otherwise that would be something they would call, you know -- "plagiarism"."






    --

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