• Re: How we got here on the power situation

    From Crash@21:1/5 to Gordon on Thu Aug 8 11:10:45 2024
    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:

    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >power situation arose.

    Unfortunately the article is only available to subscribers.


    --
    Crash McBash

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Gordon@21:1/5 to All on Wed Aug 7 23:04:44 2024
    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this power situation arose.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Rich80105@21:1/5 to Gordon on Thu Aug 8 14:16:22 2024
    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:

    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >power situation arose.

    Behind a paywall so I could not see it.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mutley@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Thu Aug 8 16:26:01 2024
    Rich80105 <[email protected]> wrote:

    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:

    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >>power situation arose.

    Behind a paywall so I could not see it.

    I read it ok and not a subscriber.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Rich80105@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 8 17:57:38 2024
    On Thu, 08 Aug 2024 16:26:01 +1200, Mutley <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    Rich80105 <[email protected]> wrote:

    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:
    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >>>power situation arose.

    Behind a paywall so I could not see it.

    I read it ok and not a subscriber.

    I suspect you saw it through another avenue than the url given above
    then.

    Radio NZ had an interesting interview with someone from Electric Kiwi: https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/news-bulletin-podcast/story/2018950335/rnz-news-at-5pm-august-8

    The reality is that the system is working exactly as was intended in
    the Bradford Reforms of a previous National

    For a blast from the past: "Lower prices and a real choice of who
    supplies your electricity � that's what the Coalition Government's
    electricity reforms are all about,� Bradford said in a 1998 government
    press release.�
    and that is from: https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/the-bradford-reforms-25-years-on#article-electricity-prices-have-continued-to-go-up

    also from that article (from August last year):
    "Letting the power generators also be retailers enables them to
    maintain a stranglehold on the market, because the other independent
    retailers have to buy electricity on the wholesale market from the
    gentailers, who they are also competing against.

    This is a fundamental flaw in the electricity market structure.�It
    makes it very hard for independent retailers to make inroads. The flaw
    serves to lower competition, which reduces innovation and increases
    prices."

    The reality is that under law the Directors (and that includes the
    Government appointed directors) are required to maximise value to
    shareholders - those who were sold the shares cheaply by the National
    Party government.

    And as the Electric Kiwi person said, they have resource consents for
    a number of large new generation projects, but have not started work
    on many of them - it is in the interests of shareholders to play
    chicken with shortages and use of coal - whenever they manage to
    create a crisis the price for all of the generating companies goes up!
    - and surprise surprise profits rise!

    The current government knows that the system worked for them beyond
    their wildest dreams - corporate sponsorship of the parties of the
    right can now itself be regarded as a safe investment! So they lie to
    the public, but reality is starting to intrude. Watch for faux
    outrage, lies that the government can renege on contracts without any penalties, and behind the scenes they will try to get through a plea
    to keep the gravy train going by not being quite as obvious . . .

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Tony@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Thu Aug 8 07:52:07 2024
    Rich80105 <[email protected]> wrote:
    On Thu, 08 Aug 2024 16:26:01 +1200, Mutley <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    Rich80105 <[email protected]> wrote:

    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:
    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >>>>power situation arose.

    Behind a paywall so I could not see it.

    I read it ok and not a subscriber.

    I suspect you saw it through another avenue than the url given above
    then.

    Radio NZ had an interesting interview with someone from Electric Kiwi: >https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/news-bulletin-podcast/story/2018950335/rnz-news-at-5pm-august-8

    The reality is that the system is working exactly as was intended in
    the Bradford Reforms of a previous National

    For a blast from the past: "Lower prices and a real choice of who
    supplies your electricity � that's what the Coalition Government's >electricity reforms are all about,� Bradford said in a 1998 government
    press release.�
    and that is from: >https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/the-bradford-reforms-25-years-on#article-electricity-prices-have-continued-to-go-up

    also from that article (from August last year):
    "Letting the power generators also be retailers enables them to
    maintain a stranglehold on the market, because the other independent >retailers have to buy electricity on the wholesale market from the >gentailers, who they are also competing against.

    This is a fundamental flaw in the electricity market structure.�It
    makes it very hard for independent retailers to make inroads. The flaw
    serves to lower competition, which reduces innovation and increases
    prices."

    The reality is that under law the Directors (and that includes the
    Government appointed directors) are required to maximise value to >shareholders - those who were sold the shares cheaply by the National
    Party government.

    And as the Electric Kiwi person said, they have resource consents for
    a number of large new generation projects, but have not started work
    on many of them - it is in the interests of shareholders to play
    chicken with shortages and use of coal - whenever they manage to
    create a crisis the price for all of the generating companies goes up!
    - and surprise surprise profits rise!

    The current government knows that the system worked for them beyond
    their wildest dreams - corporate sponsorship of the parties of the
    right can now itself be regarded as a safe investment! So they lie to
    the public, but reality is starting to intrude. Watch for faux
    outrage, lies that the government can renege on contracts without any >penalties, and behind the scenes they will try to get through a plea
    to keep the gravy train going by not being quite as obvious . . .
    Just in your dreams.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Goodwin@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 8 20:09:18 2024
    In article <[email protected]>, mutley2000 @hotmail.com says...

    Rich80105 <[email protected]> wrote:

    On 7 Aug 2024 23:04:44 GMT, Gordon <[email protected]> wrote:

    https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350370759/new-zealands-sovereign-risk-gas-bill-comes-due


    This is worth while reading as it sets out the history/reasons of how this >>power situation arose.

    Behind a paywall so I could not see it.

    I read it ok and not a subscriber.

    Likewise.

    Might depend on how many articles you've already seen of theirs over
    some arbitrary period of time.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)