Lawsuit claims Google Maps led dad of two over collapsed bridge to his
death

Web giant accused of gross negligence by not updating app despite
complaints
...
...
The complaint [PDF] claims that the app led him across a bridge in the
city of Hickory that had been out since 2013 without being repaired.

His Jeep Gladiator fell about 20ft into a creek and Paxson drowned.
State troopers found the vehicle overturned and partially submerged.
There were no barriers or warning signs along the road leading to the
hazard, the complaint states.

https://www.theregister.com/2023/09/21/google_maps_bridge_death/?td=rt-3a

I would think the local jurisdiction is at fault by not having warning signs/etc. The county (or whatever) may have the "you can't sue the
emperor" law/ordinance/etc in place, so now they are attempting to sue
Google.

"The State of North Carolina and most governmental entities are
protected from liability by the doctrine of sovereign immunity."

I'd have to scratch on this topic, but around here, some local would
be held accountable.

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On 9/21/2023 9:38 PM, JAB wrote:

Lawsuit claims Google Maps led dad of two over collapsed bridge to his
death

Web giant accused of gross negligence by not updating app despite
complaints
...

His Jeep Gladiator fell about 20ft into a creek and Paxson drowned.
State troopers found the vehicle overturned and partially submerged.
There were no barriers or warning signs along the road leading to the
hazard, the complaint states.

How stupid can you be?? Pay freaking attention to your surroundings!
You can't blame the GPS. These morons walk among us. Being stupid has
it's price... I dearly hope that his children weren't with him.

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On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 01:39:35 -0400, Michael Trew
<[email protected]> wrote:

How stupid can you be?

Around here with a rain that caused the creek to flow over an old
bridge, a local person drove over it with a tractor, and it collapsed.

End of this story, I understand this mater was settled out of court.

Make money while being stupid....

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 00:18:57 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

Google has been informed about this bidge outage multiple times over the >years and has neglected to remove it from the routes.

Question here is by who? And was Google using county/etc maps, that
were not updated by whoever.

The road was unlit and he was driving after dark. (Road unlit and bridge
out may go together, or it just may be standard in that area.)

Rural roadways are seldom lit. Driving in the rain, I believe, and
most likely too fast.

The barricades that have been put up have been stolen
by vandals.

Around here, the county must make a good faith effort at maintaining
road signs, etc. to avoid being sued.

I suspect their lawyer knows this party can't sue local government, so
sue Google.

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In misc.news.internet.discuss, Michael Trew <[email protected]> wrote:

On 9/21/2023 9:38 PM, JAB wrote:

Lawsuit claims Google Maps led dad of two over collapsed bridge to his death

How stupid can you be?? Pay freaking attention to your surroundings!
You can't blame the GPS. These morons walk among us. Being stupid has
it's price... I dearly hope that his children weren't with him.

I've read another article about this. No, the kids were not with him,
the dad had stuck around to help clean up after a birthday party and the
kids had gone home with mom.

The road was unlit and he was driving after dark. (Road unlit and bridge
out may go together, or it just may be standard in that area.)

The bridge has been out for *years* and the land owners and local
governments still have not (a) repaired it or (b) put up difficult to
remove barricades. The barricades that have been put up have been stolen
by vandals.

Google has been informed about this bidge outage multiple times over the
years and has neglected to remove it from the routes.

So: there's plenty of blame to go around in this case.

A dump truck full of concrete scrap from a demolition project at either
end of the bridge would be cheap, effective, highly visable, and hard to
steal.

Elijah
------
or, you, know, real barricades

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In misc.news.internet.discuss, JAB <[email protected]d> wrote:

Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

Google has been informed about this bidge outage multiple times over the
years and has neglected to remove it from the routes.

Question here is by who? And was Google using county/etc maps, that
were not updated by whoever.

Google _must_ know by now that a road being in a map does not mean it is
always a suitable road. This lesson they appear to have learned in
California since I don't think they direct people onto the "fire roads" (intended for forestry work, and very unsafe in snow, and often
impassible without 4WD in other weather).

They have used their street view cars as a way to test roads in the
past. Professional human drivers can quickly assess "should I drive on
this?" when driving in good weather for street view photos.

According to the lawsuit, Google still was suggesting it as a route
months after the death.

The road was unlit and he was driving after dark. (Road unlit and bridge
out may go together, or it just may be standard in that area.)

Rural roadways are seldom lit.

Agreed, but I don't know the area.

Driving in the rain, I believe, and most likely too fast.

Driving "too fast" is like "death by heart failure" in that it is a easy
to apply catch all which really doesn't say much under scrutiny.

The barricades that have been put up have been stolen
by vandals.

Around here, the county must make a good faith effort at maintaining
road signs, etc. to avoid being sued.

I suspect their lawyer knows this party can't sue local government, so
sue Google.

Google has more money than the local government anyway: laywers like to
sue "deep pockets" because they can pay out.

https://www.smbb.com/news-article/lawsuit-filed-against-google-private-road-owners-after-motorist-misguided-by-dangerously-outdated-google-maps-fatally-crashed-off-north-carolina-bridge-to-nowhere/

The "private road" bit should be strong clue to Google to avoid it.

(Separately: Driving in Wyoming last year I had Apple Maps take me along
miles and miles of unpaved roads. But I was driving in daylight and fair weather so I just went with it.)

Elijah
------
Google probably has more money than the state government

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 01:19:48 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

(Separately: Driving in Wyoming last year I had Apple Maps take me along >miles and miles of unpaved roads. But I was driving in daylight and fair >weather so I just went with it.)

Side note - I've been on the graded dirt road....nice trip.


New Mexico State Road 52 - It is a paved 2 lane road north to the NM
59 junction and is graded dirt road for approximately 40-45 miles from
near the junction of NM 59 to the VLA. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Mexico_State_Road_52


Driving New Mexico's Loneliest Road To The Very Large Array https://woofthebeatenpath.com/driving-new-mexicos-loneliest-road-to-the-very-large-array/

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 01:19:48 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

Driving "too fast" is like "death by heart failure" in that it is a easy
to apply catch all which really doesn't say much under scrutiny.

I suspect all states have this law.



What is the law that requires you to travel at a speed appropriate to
the conditions?

The Basic Speed Law states that you must never drive faster than is
safe for present conditions, regardless of the posted speed limit.

https://driversed.com/resources/terms/basic_speed_law/

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In misc.news.internet.discuss, JAB <[email protected]d> wrote:

Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

Driving "too fast" is like "death by heart failure" in that it is a easy
to apply catch all which really doesn't say much under scrutiny.

I suspect all states have this law.

What is the law that requires you to travel at a speed appropriate to
the conditions?

The Basic Speed Law states that you must never drive faster than is
safe for present conditions, regardless of the posted speed limit.

https://driversed.com/resources/terms/basic_speed_law/

It's probably mandated by the Feds if states want to accept Federal
money for road maintainance. That's how most driving / roadway laws are standardized in the US. But that does not tell you how to determine "too
fast for present conditions regardless of the posted speed limit". And
what's a safe speed for a standard roadway and what's a safe speed for a
bridge out are very different, whether the weather is good or bad.

Sorcerer (1977)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPDO2weQXLQ

Elijah
------
_Wages of Fear_ (1953) is another telling of the same book

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 02:55:20 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

And what's a safe speed for a standard roadway
and what's a safe speed for a bridge out are
very different, whether the weather is good or bad.

Without driving that road, its unknown what he might have observed,
etc. Many drivers have the "need for speed," and drive at/above
posted speed limits. With never vehicles, there is a black box, which
records info just before an accident.

With the rain/night factors, reduced speed would be prudent. ===========================

Basic Speed Law - Unknown if Feds were involved, but in California
Code, its been around since 1963. In another state, 1974. https://law.justia.com/codes/california/2022/code-veh/division-11/chapter-7/article-1/section-22350/

In Washington, its worded differently https://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.400

I don't have the time to go down this rabbit hole, but in WA, it
appears they had specific laws for specific things at one time.

Click on this link at site listed above:
1965 ex.s. c 155 54; 1963 c 16 1. Formerly RCW 46.48.011.]
and search for "46.61.400"

Here is the link for searching https://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/dispo.aspx?cite=46.48.011 ====================================================

What does the Basic Speed Law Mean? https://driversprep.com/basic-speed-law-mean/

I have no idea how many tickets are written for this law, but it is a
catch all when actual speed is unknown.

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 01:19:48 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

Google has more money than the local government anyway: laywers like to
sue "deep pockets" because they can pay out.

Unknown if sovereign immunity exists at the state level there.


State Ports Auth., 535 U.S. 743 (2002)] Unless the state or the
federal government creates an exception to the state's sovereign
immunity, the state is immune from being sued without consent by any
citizen in federal courts, state courts, or before federal
administrative agencies.

https://biotech.law.lsu.edu/map/stateimmunity.theeleventhamendment.html

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On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 01:19:48 -0000 (UTC), Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:

The "private road" bit should be strong clue to Google to avoid it.

I just noticed this aspect

"The complaint alleges Hickory residents repeatedly tried to get
Google Maps to route traffic away from the washed-out, collapsed
bridge, and to get the owners of the hazardous private road/bridge to
fix the danger and erect proper barriers and warning signs until it
was safe."

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