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  • HOA has been maintaining land we do not own.

    From micky@21:1/5 to All on Mon Apr 3 10:09:35 2023
    Townhouse n'hood of a little more than 100 homes is 44 years old, I've
    been here 40. Some others for a long time but no one else as long.

    Today for first time, I'm involved in the landscaping, gardening. All i
    was supposed to do was show the prospective gardener around. The
    president for the last 3 years, resident much longer, shows me where the
    common areas are, but she's wrong in many cases. A previous president
    was wrong wrt my lot lines.

    HOA meetings have given hints that many don't understand what an
    easement is. They think the HOA owns the easements.

    Before I talk to her, is there any chance we do? Even if we've been
    mowing the easements for 20 years, legally and morally they still don't
    belong to us, right?

    Some neighbors would be happy to be told they own this extra land.
    Others have all along been treating the land like it's theirs. But
    others might not want the burden of mowing, etc. How do we handle them?

    Any advice is welcome.

    Also, the plat does not always precisely match reality. Small changes in
    the shape of the road were made that were never copied back to the plat.

    https://plats.msa.maryland.gov/pages/unit.aspx?cid=BA&qualifier=S&series=1236&unit=8811&page=adv1&id=253686336

    Lots at end of group are bigger, some much bigger than other lots.

    Usually 8 houses per building. Pres. thinks the area between buildings
    and near buildings are common areas. Except in two cases, I don't think
    they are. The plat shows that ownership is split between the houses on
    either side, or at the edge of the neighborhood, it is owned by the
    nearest house. I guess that means we've been paying to mow lawns we're
    not responsible for, and that would be fine if we were not seriously
    short of money.

    Also she pointed to the long thin area between the back yards of two
    parallel streets (although I'm not convinced we've really been mowing
    that. I think the people who live there have.)

    .. Of course the plat is very difficult to read because there are lot
    lines, walkway easement lines, drain pipee easement lines, dimensions,
    lot numbers, street numbers all on top of each other.





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  • From Stuart O. Bronstein@21:1/5 to micky on Mon Apr 3 16:56:12 2023
    micky <[email protected]> wrote:

    Townhouse n'hood of a little more than 100 homes is 44 years old,
    I've been here 40. Some others for a long time but no one else as
    long.

    Today for first time, I'm involved in the landscaping, gardening.
    All i was supposed to do was show the prospective gardener around.
    The president for the last 3 years, resident much longer, shows
    me where the common areas are, but she's wrong in many cases. A
    previous president was wrong wrt my lot lines.

    HOA meetings have given hints that many don't understand what an
    easement is. They think the HOA owns the easements.

    Before I talk to her, is there any chance we do? Even if we've
    been mowing the easements for 20 years, legally and morally they
    still don't belong to us, right?

    If they are actually easements, then it is highly unlikely that you
    own them. But exactly what are your rights? You have to go into the
    real estate records and determine the exact provisions of the
    easement.

    Some neighbors would be happy to be told they own this extra land.
    Others have all along been treating the land like it's theirs. But
    others might not want the burden of mowing, etc. How do we handle
    them?

    Again, you have to find out what the easement says. If it's an
    easement, who is the actual owner? Are you sure you don't own the
    land and have given an easement to someone else, like the power
    company for example?

    Any advice is welcome.

    Also, the plat does not always precisely match reality. Small
    changes in the shape of the road were made that were never copied
    back to the plat.

    In my experience a road isn't actually owned by the municipality -
    they, in essence, have an easement over your property. So normally
    changing shapes of a road wouldn't change who owns what.

    https://plats.msa.maryland.gov/pages/unit.aspx?cid=BA&qualifier=S&s eries=1236&unit=8811&page=adv1&id=253686336

    Lots at end of group are bigger, some much bigger than other lots.

    Usually 8 houses per building. Pres. thinks the area between
    buildings and near buildings are common areas. Except in two
    cases, I don't think they are. The plat shows that ownership is
    split between the houses on either side, or at the edge of the
    neighborhood, it is owned by the nearest house. I guess that means
    we've been paying to mow lawns we're not responsible for, and that
    would be fine if we were not seriously short of money.

    If it actually does belong to someone else, and if there is no actual
    easement, you may have prescriptive rights, meaning it's as if you
    owned it.

    Also she pointed to the long thin area between the back yards of
    two parallel streets (although I'm not convinced we've really been
    mowing that. I think the people who live there have.)

    .. Of course the plat is very difficult to read because there
    are lot lines, walkway easement lines, drain pipee easement lines, dimensions, lot numbers, street numbers all on top of each other.

    These documents are generally much, much larger, so that they are
    easier to read when they are printed out.


    --
    Stu
    http://DownToEarthLawyer.com


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