However, when I install epiphany it takes over every single thing that
web browsers can do which is very frustrating, I only want to run it explicitly for testing. Is there any way to prevent the install
changing all the mailcap and mime settings etc.?
Chris Green <[email protected]> writes:
However, when I install epiphany it takes over every single thing that
web browsers can do which is very frustrating, I only want to run it explicitly for testing. Is there any way to prevent the install
changing all the mailcap and mime settings etc.?
What I've done is configure "everything" (in my case that means urxvt, Konsole, Emacs, Thunderbird and not much else) to use x-www-browser and
then I use update-alternatives to configure what that means. Firefox in
my case.
I guess this can still work when using a non-Debian browser like
Vivaldi, maybe some extra work is needed to make update-alternatives
aware of Vivaldi, I don't really know.
I had x-www-browser set to vivaldi but web links still got opened in epiphany, I tried changing just about every setting I could find for a browser to vivaldi but I still got epiphany.
On Mon, Feb 10, 2025 at 12:45:06 +0000, Chris Green wrote:
I had x-www-browser set to vivaldi but web links still got opened in epiphany, I tried changing just about every setting I could find for a browser to vivaldi but I still got epiphany.
There isn't a single interface for defining what you mean by a "default
web browser". Each application does this however its authors saw fit
to implement.
Invoking /usr/bin/x-www-browser is one way, and setting that link will
work for the apps that implement this choice.
Some apps use XDG's way, which is described at <https://stackoverflow.com/questions/41172692/xdg-open-does-not-open-the-default-browser#comments-link-41172692>.
Others may use MIME, in which case you would configure some file
or other. It used to be ~/.mailcap but apparently XDG is trying to
move this to ~/.config/mimeapps.list (according to <https://stackoverflow.com/questions/57667116/how-do-i-set-the-default-browser-for-xdg-open-on-centos-7-if-xdg-settings-has-no#comments-link-57667116>).
Still other applications may respect an environment variable, such
as $BROWSER, or they may only have their own unique configuration
for it.
Welcome to Unix/Linux.
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or another
browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather
than having to try and unset all the changes it has made.
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or another browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather
than having to try and unset all the changes it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends to be
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or another
browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather
than having to try and unset all the changes it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
"oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany",
having to log out and log in to another user to do this rather defeats
the object.
It might also take me down a never ending trail of 'is it the environment/settings or is it the program?'. :-)
I guess some sort of chrooted environment to install it (epiphany) in
might work (though still gives the environment/settings question).
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for
everything, rather than having to try and unset all the changes
it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends to be
"oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany",
having to log out and log in to another user to do this rather defeats
the object.
It might also take me down a never ending trail of 'is it the environment/settings or is it the program?'. :-)
I guess some sort of chrooted environment to install it (epiphany) in
might work (though still gives the environment/settings question).
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for
everything, rather than having to try and unset all the changes
it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends to be
"oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany", having to log out and log in to another user to do this rather defeats
the object.
I simply have a terminal already running as another user (I start a
terminal and then su - another_user) so I just have to type the browser
name if I want to use it. Or use up-arrow to access the browser
history. For me that seems to be a tolerable level of effort.
[email protected] wrote:
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather than having to try and unset all the changes
it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set upI guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends to be "oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany", having to log out and log in to another user to do this rather defeats the object.
another user.
I simply have a terminal already running as another user (I start a terminal and then su - another_user) so I just have to type the browser name if I want to use it. Or use up-arrow to access the browser
history. For me that seems to be a tolerable level of effort.
How does that help? The other user will have all the same default
browser settings that you do. You can't install something for use by
one user and not another user, at least not using apt you can't.
[-- text/plain, encoding quoted-printable, charset: utf-8, 39 lines --]
On Tue, Feb 11, 2025 at 08:21:02PM +0000, Chris Green wrote:
[email protected] wrote:
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather than having to try and unset all the changes
it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends to be "oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany", having to log out and log in to another user to do this rather defeats the object.
I simply have a terminal already running as another user (I start a terminal and then su - another_user) so I just have to type the browser name if I want to use it. Or use up-arrow to access the browser
history. For me that seems to be a tolerable level of effort.
How does that help? The other user will have all the same default
browser settings that you do. You can't install something for use by
one user and not another user, at least not using apt you can't.
Those DE-ish (and related) configuration things typically happen per-user (apart from Debian's alternatives mechanism, but if I have been following along, that one has been discarded already in the discussion).
Just imagine setting a default browser for yourself and forcing all the
other users into it...
[email protected] wrote:
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather than having to try and unset all the
changes it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends
to be "oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany", having to log out and log in to another user to do
this rather defeats the object.
I simply have a terminal already running as another user (I start a terminal and then su - another_user) so I just have to type theHow does that help? The other user will have all the same default
browser name if I want to use it. Or use up-arrow to access the
browser history. For me that seems to be a tolerable level of
effort.
browser settings that you do. You can't install something for use by
one user and not another user, at least not using apt you can't.
Er, but that's the whole problem!!! I installed epiphany (using apt)
and it **did** force all 'the other users' (including me) to use it.
You have described the problem in a nutshell! :-)
Installing epiphany just added it as a choice but left vivaldi as the configured browser, but still epiphany grabbed everything.
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
[email protected] wrote:
Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
songbird <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
...
It would be much easier if I could simply tell epiphany (or
another browser) **not** to try and become the default for everything, rather than having to try and unset all the
changes it has made.
Chris, for something like testing i would just set up
another user.
I guess that's a possible way. However my use of epiphany tends
to be "oh, this web page doesn't work in vivaldi, I'll try it in epiphany", having to log out and log in to another user to do
this rather defeats the object.
I simply have a terminal already running as another user (I start a terminal and then su - another_user) so I just have to type theHow does that help? The other user will have all the same default
browser name if I want to use it. Or use up-arrow to access the
browser history. For me that seems to be a tolerable level of
effort.
browser settings that you do. You can't install something for use by
one user and not another user, at least not using apt you can't.
I was responding to your point immediately before what I wrote, and
what it avoids is having to log out and log in again as a different
user. The other user does NOT have the same settings as me. They have
their own set of plugins and settings as Tomas has pointed out. You
very much can install something for one user and not for another in a browser.
I'm just wondering if a way round the issue may be to unistall
vivaldi, then install epiphany, then re-install vivaldi. It might be
that just doing 'apt reinstall vivaldi' will get me back to where I
want to be.
Chris Green <[email protected]> writes:
Installing epiphany just added it as a choice but left vivaldi as the configured browser, but still epiphany grabbed everything.
Have you considered you may get better information if you actually
define this "everything"? For me it's the small handful of apps I
mentioned and possibly a few more, like PDF viewers. Then again, I
probably don't remember the settings I've used for each program unless I
made notes and can find them again...
[email protected] wrote:
The other user does NOT have the same settings as me. They have
their own set of plugins and settings as Tomas has pointed out. You
very much can install something for one user and not for another in a browser.
How? If I install epiphany using alt then it sets itself as the
default browser in just about every location I know about and some
that I don't. These settings apply to all users on the system.
The specific thing that bit me when I installed epiphany was clicking
on a web link in a terminal (xfce4-terminal) window. Instead of
opening the link in the already running vivaldi, in another workspace
(which is the way I like it) it fired up epiphany and splatted it on
top of the text I was looking at.
On Wed, Feb 12, 2025 at 10:06:53 +0000, Chris Green wrote:
The specific thing that bit me when I installed epiphany was clicking
on a web link in a terminal (xfce4-terminal) window. Instead of
opening the link in the already running vivaldi, in another workspace (which is the way I like it) it fired up epiphany and splatted it on
top of the text I was looking at.
When I google this, I get a bunch of stupidity ("It uses your system default!") but then it goes on to give a few answer links that look promising.
Chris Green (12025-02-12):
I'm just wondering if a way round the issue may be to unistall
vivaldi, then install epiphany, then re-install vivaldi. It might be
that just doing 'apt reinstall vivaldi' will get me back to where I
want to be.
That might be a way, but it would be less efficient than installing
Windows or Macos instead of Linux.
If you want a Linux way to solve the issue: first, read the
documentation of xfce-terminal to see how it decides which web browser
to run; then read the documentation of that mechanism to see how to
configure it.
On Wed, Feb 12, 2025 at 10:02:13 +0000, Chris Green wrote:
[email protected] wrote:
The other user does NOT have the same settings as me. They have
their own set of plugins and settings as Tomas has pointed out. You
very much can install something for one user and not for another in a browser.
How? If I install epiphany using alt then it sets itself as the
default browser in just about every location I know about and some
that I don't. These settings apply to all users on the system.
Installing a browser is very different from installing something IN a browser.
If you have two users A and B, and you install a new web browser (as
root), and if for some reason this new web browser becomes the new x-www-browser alternative, then some applications may select it, which
is one possible root cause for the problem that Chris Green is describing.
It's also possible that some applications may select it as a default
using their own individual heuristics, without going through the x-www-browser symbolic link. I can easily imagine some GUI app has a hard-coded list of browser names that it looks for, and it simply uses
the first one that it finds while traversing that list.
Now, suppose user A installs a new add-on in Firefox. This only goes
into their own home directory, and will not be seen by user B in Firefox. This is what debian-user@howorth is describing.
I would not be surprised if it is not explicitly documented.
On 2025-02-12, Nicolas George <[email protected]> wrote:
Max Nikulin (HE12025-02-12):
I would not be surprised if it is not explicitly documented.
At worst, the source code is the documentation.
I think Chris had the right idea. Install Epiphany first, and then
Vivaldi, instead of the other way around.
Problem solved.
That said, I believe the three-browser problem is not generally solvable.
:-)
Anssi Saari <[email protected]> wrote:
Chris Green <[email protected]> writes:
Installing epiphany just added it as a choice but left vivaldi as the configured browser, but still epiphany grabbed everything.
Have you considered you may get better information if you actually
define this "everything"? For me it's the small handful of apps I
mentioned and possibly a few more, like PDF viewers. Then again, I
probably don't remember the settings I've used for each program unless I made notes and can find them again...
The specific thing that bit me when I installed epiphany was clicking
on a web link in a terminal (xfce4-terminal) window. Instead of
opening the link in the already running vivaldi, in another workspace
(which is the way I like it) it fired up epiphany and splatted it on
top of the text I was looking at.
Simply reversing the installation order of the two browsers seems the
most direct and easiest solution.
What is going on? You suggested examining the source code.
urlCommand "sensible-browser '%s'"
On 13/02/2025 01:26, Greg Wooledge wrote:
Now Debian has*two* completely separate
ways to specify a default application for a role.
I believed there are at least 4 ways (besides settings specific to
particular applications)
- *browser alternatives
- BROWSER environment
- mailcap for text/html
- XDG configuration
On 13/02/2025 01:26, Greg Wooledge wrote:
Now Debian has*two* completely separate
ways to specify a default application for a role.
I believed there are at least 4 ways (besides settings specific to
particular applications)
- *browser alternatives
- BROWSER environment
- mailcap for text/html
- XDG configuration
sensible-browser, "open", and xdg-open just use some of these options.
On 2025-02-13, Chris Green <[email protected]> wrote:
Max Nikulin <[email protected]> wrote:
On 13/02/2025 01:26, Greg Wooledge wrote:
Now Debian has*two* completely separate
ways to specify a default application for a role.
I believed there are at least 4 ways (besides settings specific to
particular applications)
- *browser alternatives
- BROWSER environment
- mailcap for text/html
- XDG configuration
sensible-browser, "open", and xdg-open just use some of these options.
There's also all the MIME confguration.
Maybe you can see exactly what's going on by examining Epiphany's post install
script in /var/lib/dpkg/info/.
For firefox-esr, it's
#!/bin/sh -e
if [ "$1" = "configure" ] || [ "$1" = "abort-upgrade" ] ; then
update-alternatives --install /usr/bin/x-www-browser \
x-www-browser /usr/bin/firefox-esr 70 \
--slave /usr/share/man/man1/x-www-browser.1.gz \
x-www-browser.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/firefox-esr.1.gz
update-alternatives --remove mozilla /usr/bin/firefox-esr
update-alternatives --install /usr/bin/gnome-www-browser \
gnome-www-browser /usr/bin/firefox-esr 70 \
--slave /usr/share/man/man1/gnome-www-browser.1.gz \
gnome-www-browser.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/firefox-esr.1.gz
fi
if [ "$1" = "configure" ] ; then
rm -rf /usr/lib/firefox-esr/updates
fi
Good luck.
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