On 27/1/25 09:11, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to the point
that I have to hold the off button on the computer for about 10 seconds before it turns off.  I am using Chrominum and I hate it.  I have a VPN
but I still don't trust anything from Google.  I forgot how to remove
the update and use the older version.  At 74 I am forgetting a lot of
things I did before, I mean years ago.  I hate to keep bugging you guys
but I refuse to use Winblows.  Can someone please help me out.

Moe

Maybe consider this
https://librewolf.net/

?

..
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
(UTC+0800)
..............

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On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 08:11:48PM -0500, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to the point that I have to hold the off button on the computer for about 10 seconds before it turns off.� I am using Chrominum and I hate it.� I have a VPN but I still don't trust anything from Google.� I forgot how to remove the update and use the older version.� At 74 I am forgetting a lot of things I did before, I mean years ago.� I hate to keep bugging you guys but I refuse to use Winblows.� Can someone please help me out.

Hi Moe,

Are there any other symptoms? How much memory do you have in your computer?

Does this happen with just one window open - so nothing else closed down
as a tab?

If you run top (or any other performance indicator) at the same time,
do you see any pattern to what processes are running?

Also - this is the Debian version - the Firefox ESR - and not a newer
version from Mozilla themselves?

Rather than moving to yet another browser, lets see if we can narrow
down causes. Someone else a while ago was mentioning the same problem
but with the newer versions of Thunderbird - do you have a Thunderbird
window somewhere in the background, perhaps?

All the very best, as ever,

Andy Cater
([email protected])

Moe

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Hi,

I am one of the the other people who are experiencing Firefox freezing up the whole desktop computer, requiring the computer to be turned of (hold down the power button or throw switch at the power point).

We believe the issue is related to various ads that show on some web pages.

Our current solution is not to open those pages, and to use Chromium.

We have several computers in the house. Only one computer has a major issue, and they are the only user who goes to the page which is known to lock-up.

They also use three monitors, Debian 12 with KDE (now using X11, as Wayland had more frequent issues).

Your reporting of your issue has encouraged me to test run our suspected web page on other computers to replicate the lock ups.

Is there anything in your user Firefox setting you need to keep? For example pinned pages, remembered passwords, and/or bookmarks, or any other user settings that you need?

If not then I recommend wiping all user settings for Firefox and then reloading Firefox. I had to do this one time a year or so ago. It was sad to loose my many bookmarks but it did clean out my Firefox. Below is how I wiped my user settings, maybe
someone can tell you a better way?

I think I used something like:
$ rm -rf .cache/mozilla/firefox
$ rm -rf .mozilla/firefox

rm -rf can be a bit dangerous if you make a typo, so maybe a safer way to do this is to use a file manager, turn on hidden files, and then delete these "firefox" folders?

If firefox still freezes your computer when you first load it up, I would:
# apt purge firefox-esr
# systemctl reboot
(log in again)
# apt install firefox-esr

If Firefox still freezes on initial load (i.e. before you go to any of your web sites), I suspect a hardware fault. I think firefox can use direct hardware for making pages faster.
"Firefox on Fedora supports hardware acceleration on Linux so let's look how to configure it and diagnose potential issues. "
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Firefox_Hardware_acceleration

https://wiki.debian.org/HardwareVideoAcceleration


George.

George.



On Tuesday, 28-01-2025 at 08:07 Maureen Thomas wrote:

Hi Andy,

I use Thuderbird for my email and have no problem with it.  Yes, the Firefox I use is the ESR version that comes with debian.  It happens
when I open Firefox and it just freezes before I can even use it.  I do have to pages pinned to it so when it opens those pages are opened. I
don't even have time to unpin those to see if they are the problem. 
This started after an update for Firefox from Debian.

I am not familiar with Top.  Thunderbird stays open while I am on the computer but I tried to load Firefox alone, after I booted up and it
still froze the computer.

On 1/27/25 3:26 AM, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:

On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 08:11:48PM -0500, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since the
updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to the point that
I have to hold the off button on the computer for about 10 seconds before it
turns off.  I am using Chrominum and I hate it.  I have a VPN but I still
don't trust anything from Google.  I forgot how to remove the update and use
the older version.  At 74 I am forgetting a lot of things I did before, I >> mean years ago.  I hate to keep bugging you guys but I refuse to use
Winblows.  Can someone please help me out.

Hi Moe,

Are there any other symptoms? How much memory do you have in your computer?

Does this happen with just one window open - so nothing else closed down
as a tab?

If you run top (or any other performance indicator) at the same time,
do you see any pattern to what processes are running?

Also - this is the Debian version - the Firefox ESR - and not a newer version from Mozilla themselves?

Rather than moving to yet another browser, lets see if we can narrow
down causes. Someone else a while ago was mentioning the same problem
but with the newer versions of Thunderbird - do you have a Thunderbird window somewhere in the background, perhaps?

All the very best, as ever,

Andy Cater
([email protected])

Moe

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On Tue, 28 Jan 2025 10:57:44 +1100
George at Clug <[email protected]> wrote:

If not then I recommend wiping all user settings for Firefox and then reloading Firefox. I had to do this one time a year or so ago. It was
sad to loose my many bookmarks but it did clean out my Firefox.
Below is how I wiped my user settings, maybe someone can tell you a
better way?

I think I used something like:
$ rm -rf .cache/mozilla/firefox
$ rm -rf .mozilla/firefox

ACK! Dangerous, as you say. Instead, rename the directories so you can
recover the whole or part of it. e.g.:

mv ~/.cache/mozilla/firefox ~/.cache/mozilla/firefox.old

--
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

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On 1/26/25 17:11, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since
the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to
the point that I have to hold the off button on the computer for
about 10 seconds before it turns off. I am using Chrominum and I
hate it. I have a VPN but I still don't trust anything from
Google. I forgot how to remove the update and use the older
version. At 74 I am forgetting a lot of things I did before, I mean
years ago. I hate to keep bugging you guys but I refuse to use
Winblows. Can someone please help me out.

On 1/27/25 13:07, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I use Thuderbird for my email and have no problem with it. Yes,
the Firefox I use is the ESR version that comes with debian. It
happens when I open Firefox and it just freezes before I can even
use it. I do have to pages pinned to it so when it opens those
pages are opened. I don't even have time to unpin those to see if
they are the problem. This started after an update for Firefox from
Debian.

I am not familiar with Top. Thunderbird stays open while I am on
the computer but I tried to load Firefox alone, after I booted up
and it still froze the computer.

What is the make and model of the computer? Processor? Memory
module(s)? Disk drives? How are the disk drives connected? What is
contained on the disk drives?


Do you have a recent image of the disk drive containing Debian?


Do you have current backups? If so, what is backed up? If not, please
backup now.


David

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On Tue, Jan 28, 2025 at 11:12:43PM -0500, Maureen Thomas wrote:

On 1/28/25 9:58 PM, David Christensen wrote:

What is the make and model of the computer?� Processor?� Memory
module(s)?� Disk drives?� How are the disk drives connected?� What is contained on the disk drives?

Do� you have a recent image of the disk drive containing Debian?

Do you have current backups?� If so, what is backed up?� If not, please backup now.

Its a HP Desktop� M01-F3XXX with AMD Ryzen 5 5600G Radeon Graphics, Realtec Audio� 6.0.9400.1, 237 GB Drive, 8GB Ram .� That harddrive holds Debian installed only. I have a 2 TB hard drive for my back up.� So all of my files are backed up daily. I do not have an image of the HD contained in the HP.

As I see it, are these parts missing:
* Focus on the original problem
* Effort for making reading in the discussion order possible


Thing that I haven't seen yet is follow-up on

| > If not then I recommend wiping all user settings for Firefox and then
| > reloading Firefox. I had to do this one time a year or so ago. It was
| > sad to loose my many bookmarks but it did clean out my Firefox.
| > Below is how I wiped my user settings, maybe someone can tell you a
| > better way?
| >
| > I think I used something like:
| > $ rm -rf .cache/mozilla/firefox
| > $ rm -rf .mozilla/firefox
|
| ACK! Dangerous, as you say. Instead, rename the directories so you can
| recover the whole or part of it. e.g.:
|
| mv ~/.cache/mozilla/firefox ~/.cache/mozilla/firefox.old
|


Regards
Geert Stappers
User of Firefox and Debian 12
Happy user of Firefox and Debian 12
--
Silence is hard to parse

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On 1/28/25 20:12, Maureen Thomas wrote:

On 1/28/25 9:58 PM, David Christensen wrote:

On 1/26/25 17:11, Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox.
Since the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my
computer to the point that I have to hold the off button on the
computer for about 10 seconds before it turns off.

What is the make and model of the computer? Processor? Memory
module(s)? Disk drives? How are the disk drives connected? What
is contained on the disk drives?

Do you have a recent image of the disk drive containing Debian?

Do you have current backups? If so, what is backed up? If not,
please backup now.

Its a HP Desktop M01-F3XXX with AMD Ryzen 5 5600G Radeon Graphics,
Realtec Audio 6.0.9400.1, 237 GB Drive, 8GB Ram . That harddrive
holds Debian installed only. I have a 2 TB hard drive for my back
up. So all of my files are backed up daily. I do not have an image
of the HD contained in the HP.

I will assume the "237 GB Drive" is a "256 GB" NVMe PCIe SSD, per:

https://www.amazon.com/HP-M01-F3006-Desktop-Bluetooth-Windows/dp/B0BY33VMN8


I see two choices:

1. "Find the needle in the haystack and remove it". I have found this solution requires an unknown amount of knowledge (that I typically do
not have), an unknown amount of effort, and an unknown amount of time.
It produces a result of unknown reliability. Per the information
technology "15 minute rule", I might attempt this; and move on if I do
not succeed quickly.

2. Backup the data and configuration settings, wipe, reinstall, and
restore. This solution requires a known amount of knowledge (that I
already have), a known amount of effort, and a known amount of time. It produces a known good result, but requires that I backup regularly (or
know how to recover the needed files from the problem disk). In the
past, I did this more times than I can count.

2b. Backup the data and configuration settings, restore the last known
good image, update, and restore the data and configuration settings.
This is an accelerated version of #2, with the additional requirement
that I take images regularly. This is what I do.


It would be wise to duplicate the 2 TB backup drive onto another 2 TB
drive, and store the duplicate off-site. Going forward, duplicate
periodically or rotate on-site and off-site disks. I make two
duplicates of my backups, and rotate the duplicates.


David

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On Friday, 31-01-2025 at 12:35 Lee wrote:

On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 2:57 AM Jeffrey Walton wrote:

On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 11:17 PM Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to the point that I have to hold the off button on the computer for about 10 seconds before it turns off.

You might try to disable hardware acceleration in the browser to see
if it a Firefox problem: <https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/upgrade-graphics-drivers-use-hardware-acceleration#w_turning-off-hardware-acceleration>.

Which requires running firefox -- which is the problem - correct?

Yes, I did laugh at that suggestion myself.

Try starting firefox with a new profile - if you've got firefox esr
installed it's probably

The good new is that the problem has been solved via a rename of the .mozilla folder which would cause a new, clean user folder to be created the next time Firefox was started.

firefox-esr --ProfileManager

which will let you create a new, empty, profile. Maybe that's enough
to fix your problem?

Regards
Lee

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On Friday, 31-01-2025 at 16:01 Jeffrey Walton wrote:

On Thu, Jan 30, 2025 at 11:42 PM Lee <[email protected]> wrote:

On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 2:57 AM Jeffrey Walton wrote:

On Sun, Jan 26, 2025 at 11:17 PM Maureen Thomas wrote:

I am using an updated Debian 12 with Thurderbird and Firefox. Since the updated firefox I can not use it as it freezes my computer to the point that I have to hold the off button on the computer for about 10 seconds before it turns off.

You might try to disable hardware acceleration in the browser to see
if it a Firefox problem: <https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/upgrade-graphics-drivers-use-hardware-acceleration#w_turning-off-hardware-acceleration>.

Which requires running firefox -- which is the problem - correct?

We don't know when the freeze occurs. It was not stated in the problem statement.

In one of the replies, Marueen reported: " It happens when I open Firefox and it just freezes before I can even use it."

As people make replies, they often trim the original message so this message could have been lost in later posts.

You may be able to find the original comment in the archive list?

I wonder if the suggestion " firefox-esr --ProfileManager" may have loaded a working Firefox?

George.

Try starting firefox with a new profile - if you've got firefox esr installed it's probably

firefox-esr --ProfileManager

which will let you create a new, empty, profile. Maybe that's enough
to fix your problem?

Jeff

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