Hi.

Do you know if there is a wiki similar to DokuWiki but that uses
Markdown as a syntax, not a custom one nobody else uses, packaged in
Debian? Bonus points if it can use Git to manage its texts.

I found gitit, that looks interesting, but I have not found a public
sandbox on the web to see the user interface: I do not know if it has
buttons in the editor for people who do not know the syntax; I shall try tomorrow possibly. Also, it has its own web server, which would be a
problem for the use I have in mind, especially multiple instances.

Any suggestion?

If it is not packaged by Debian but simple and reliable, I can give it a
try too.

Thanks.

--
Nicolas George

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On Wed, Jan 22, 2025 at 05:43:44PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote:

Hi.

Do you know if there is a wiki similar to DokuWiki but that uses
Markdown as a syntax, not a custom one nobody else uses, packaged in
Debian? Bonus points if it can use Git to manage its texts.

I found gitit, that looks interesting, but I have not found a public
sandbox on the web to see the user interface: I do not know if it has
buttons in the editor for people who do not know the syntax; I shall try tomorrow possibly. Also, it has its own web server, which would be a
problem for the use I have in mind, especially multiple instances.

Any suggestion?

SSG, Static Site Generators. Example given: Zola ( https://getzola.org ).

For the more wiki experience `zola serve`
( https://www.getzola.org/documentation/getting-started/cli-usage/ )
So webbrowser in one window and your favorite text editor in another window.

If it is not packaged by Debian but simple and reliable, I can give it a
try too.

https://www.getzola.org/documentation/getting-started/installation/

Thanks.

Nicolas George

Groeten
Geert Stappers
--
Silence is hard to parse

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Nicolas George wrote:

Hi.

Do you know if there is a wiki similar to DokuWiki but that uses
Markdown as a syntax, not a custom one nobody else uses, packaged in
Debian? Bonus points if it can use Git to manage its texts.

Would the dokuwiki plugin to accept Markdown work for you?

-dsr-

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Nicolas George <[email protected]> wrote:

Hi.

Do you know if there is a wiki similar to DokuWiki but that uses
Markdown as a syntax, not a custom one nobody else uses, packaged in
Debian? Bonus points if it can use Git to manage its texts.

I found gitit, that looks interesting, but I have not found a public
sandbox on the web to see the user interface: I do not know if it has
buttons in the editor for people who do not know the syntax; I shall try tomorrow possibly. Also, it has its own web server, which would be a
problem for the use I have in mind, especially multiple instances.

Any suggestion?

If it is not packaged by Debian but simple and reliable, I can give it a
try too.

I wrote a RestructuredText plugin for Dokuwiki that means (not
surprisingly!) that you can use RestructuredText markup in Dokuwiki.
You can even simply name a text file with a .rst suffix and the plugin
will recognise it and treat the whole file as RestructuredText, no
need for any Dokuwiki markup at all within the text.

The plugin is available from the Dokuwiki site:-

https://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:rst

It says it's not been updated in more than 2 years which is true but I
think it still works OK, if not I'm happy to fix it if needed.

Does this help any? RestructuredText is more like MarkDown than
Dokuwiki markup is, I think.

It was a very simple plugin to write, you might find it easy to copy
and change to work with MarkDown. Is there a simple single executable
program to convert MarkDown to HTML (as there is for RestructuredText)?

--
Chris Green
·

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Chris Green wrote:

Does this help any? RestructuredText is more like MarkDown than
Dokuwiki markup is, I think.

It was a very simple plugin to write, you might find it easy to copy
and change to work with MarkDown. Is there a simple single executable program to convert MarkDown to HTML (as there is for RestructuredText)?

pandoc.

For any text-like-format to any other, pandoc is usually a great
answer.

-dsr-

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Dan Ritter (12025-01-22):

Would the dokuwiki plugin to accept Markdown work for you?

Sorry, I wanted to say it in my first mail but forgot before hitting the <esc>:wq<enter><enter> keys.

Tried one, does not work.

Read the docs, the other are worse.

The plugins slap Markdown on top of the DokuWiki syntax, but the custom
syntax is still there interacting with Markdown and the editor buttons
are still made for the custom syntax.

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

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Chris Green (12025-01-22):

I wrote a RestructuredText plugin for Dokuwiki that means (not
surprisingly!) that you can use RestructuredText markup in Dokuwiki.
You can even simply name a text file with a .rst suffix and the plugin
will recognise it and treat the whole file as RestructuredText, no
need for any Dokuwiki markup at all within the text.

The plugin is available from the Dokuwiki site:-

https://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:rst

It says it's not been updated in more than 2 years which is true but I
think it still works OK, if not I'm happy to fix it if needed.

Does this help any? RestructuredText is more like MarkDown than
Dokuwiki markup is, I think.

It was a very simple plugin to write, you might find it easy to copy
and change to work with MarkDown. Is there a simple single executable program to convert MarkDown to HTML (as there is for RestructuredText)?

Thanks, but it does not work, same problem as with the existing Markdown plugins. I am not asking my users to write <rst> or <markdown> in their
files, I am not having my users disagree because one did and the other
did not and now they want to edit each other's page.

Plus, I suspect just like the markdowku plugin, the one that does not
require explicitly saying <markdown>, the buttons still produce custom
syntax.

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

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Geert Stappers (12025-01-22):

SSG, Static Site Generators. Example given: Zola ( https://getzola.org ).

For the more wiki experience `zola serve`
( https://www.getzola.org/documentation/getting-started/cli-usage/ )
So webbrowser in one window and your favorite text editor in another window.

I might be wrong, but it does not look remotely like a wiki. Would you
explain?

--
Nicolas George

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On Wed, Jan 22, 2025 at 08:00:26PM +0100, Nicolas George wrote:

Geert Stappers (12025-01-22):

On Wed, Jan 22, 2025, Nicolas George wrote:

... Wiki ...
... markdown ...
... git ...
Any suggestions?

SSG, Static Site Generators. Example given: Zola ( https://getzola.org ).

For the more wiki experience `zola serve`
( https://www.getzola.org/documentation/getting-started/cli-usage/ )
So webbrowser in one window and your favorite text editor in another window.

I might be wrong, but it does not look remotely like a wiki.

Consider that none of us is wrong, consider different points of view.

Would you explain?

} Please explain

Wiki: Present HTML to reader, as for 99% of Wikipedia.org visitors.

I left out that "Wiki" also means "allow edit through webbrowser".

"SSG" was suggested in response to the '> > > Any suggestions?'

The '> > So webbrowser in one window' for "Preview",
'your favorite text editor in another window' for avoiding the annoyance
of missing editor features in "edit throught webbrowser".


Groeten
Geert Stappers
--
Silence is hard to parse

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Geert Stappers (12025-01-22):

Wiki: Present HTML to reader, as for 99% of Wikipedia.org visitors.

I left out that "Wiki" also means "allow edit through webbrowser".

"SSG" was suggested in response to the '> > > Any suggestions?'

The '> > So webbrowser in one window' for "Preview",
'your favorite text editor in another window' for avoiding the annoyance
of missing editor features in "edit throught webbrowser".

So you assumed that when I asked for a wiki, I had not really thought
about it in depth and I did not really want a wiki. I cannot really
blame you, so many people posting here come asking for X when it is
really Z they need.

But in the future, I suggest you keep this kind of assumption for cases
where you have strong clues that it is the case or for when some time
has passed and no satisfactory answer was given.

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

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Nicolas George <[email protected]> wrote:

Chris Green (12025-01-22):

I wrote a RestructuredText plugin for Dokuwiki that means (not surprisingly!) that you can use RestructuredText markup in Dokuwiki.
You can even simply name a text file with a .rst suffix and the plugin
will recognise it and treat the whole file as RestructuredText, no
need for any Dokuwiki markup at all within the text.

The plugin is available from the Dokuwiki site:-

https://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:rst

It says it's not been updated in more than 2 years which is true but I think it still works OK, if not I'm happy to fix it if needed.

Does this help any? RestructuredText is more like MarkDown than
Dokuwiki markup is, I think.

It was a very simple plugin to write, you might find it easy to copy
and change to work with MarkDown. Is there a simple single executable program to convert MarkDown to HTML (as there is for RestructuredText)?

Thanks, but it does not work, same problem as with the existing Markdown plugins. I am not asking my users to write <rst> or <markdown> in their files, I am not having my users disagree because one did and the other
did not and now they want to edit each other's page.

Plus, I suspect just like the markdowku plugin, the one that does not
require explicitly saying <markdown>, the buttons still produce custom syntax.

Yes to your last comment, while the content of the .rst file is pure RestructuredText of course the Dokuwiki editor when you edit a page
will still be the Dokuwiki editor. I assume that's what you mean by
"the buttons still produce custom syntax.".

I don't think you're going to find what you want somehow! :-)

--
Chris Green
·

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Chris Green (12025-01-22):

Yes to your last comment, while the content of the .rst file is pure RestructuredText of course the Dokuwiki editor when you edit a page
will still be the Dokuwiki editor. I assume that's what you mean by
"the buttons still produce custom syntax.".

Yes, that is the issue.

I don't think you're going to find what you want somehow! :-)

As a DokuWiki plugin, probably, almost certainly, not.

As a Debian package, probably not. If it existed, odds are I would have
found it without having to ask here.

But as a non-packaged project, it is not unlikely. It is more a matter
of whether they will have drawbacks I had not anticipated, like
requiring a permanent daemon for each instance. (My goal is to run
multiple lightly-loaded instances on the same VM.)

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

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Darac Marjal (12025-01-22):

What about Mediawiki?

Because AFAIK it is a nefarious monster with huge resource consumption
and fragile dependencies. Also, the HTML it produces is atrocious.

It doesn't use Git for versioning,

So no bonus points either.

3. Extensible - There are extensions to add Markdown syntax -
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Markdown

With all the same drawbacks as the extensions that bring Markdown to
DokuWiki.

If markdown is not a hard requirement

If Markdown were not a hard requirement in “DokuWiki but in Markdown”, I could use DokuWiki.

--
Nicolas George

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On Wed Jan 22, 2025 at 4:43 PM GMT, Nicolas George wrote:

Do you know if there is a wiki similar to DokuWiki but that uses
Markdown as a syntax, not a custom one nobody else uses, packaged in
Debian? Bonus points if it can use Git to manage its texts.

It might be helpful to others for you to spell out the facets of
DokuWiki you find most important.

IkiWiki is a possibility: supports markdown (and others via plugins);
supports Git as backend. Very customisable. Quite bare-bones OOTB.
Packaged in Debian.

https://ikiwiki.info/

Disclaimer: I recently became both the Debian package maintainer and a co-maintainer upstream.

--
Please do not CC me for listmail.

👱🏻 Jonathan Dowland
✎ [email protected]
🔗 https://jmtd.net

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Jonathan Dowland (12025-01-23):

It might be helpful to others for you to spell out the facets of DokuWiki
you find most important.

Good point. I might be forgetting something, but as is:

- No need for database server.

- Passive: the web server runs the site when it is accessed. I can run
twelve dozens instances in the same server if they are accessed
rarely.

- Low-level: data is in elementary format in plain files.

- Simple: install the files in one or two directories.

- Helpful editor: buttons for people who do not know the markup language
by heart.

IkiWiki is a possibility: supports markdown (and others via plugins); supports Git as backend. Very customisable. Quite bare-bones OOTB. Packaged in Debian.

https://ikiwiki.info/

Very interesting. It seems it only fails for the last point. But maybe
it can be added easily, after all buttons like that run on client-side.

The look-and-feel seems a bit basic too, but it can probably be changed.

Thanks for the suggestion, worth considering.

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

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On Thu Jan 23, 2025 at 12:43 PM GMT, Nicolas George wrote:

https://ikiwiki.info/

Very interesting. It seems it only fails for the last point. But maybe
it can be added easily, after all buttons like that run on client-side.

That would be nice. Somebody once spent a lot of time integrating
something like this, but they then disappeared, and somehow the code was
lost: https://ikiwiki.info/todo/wikiwyg/discussion/

The look-and-feel seems a bit basic too, but it can probably be
changed.

It is. Joey (original author) was very keen to have the "antitheme" as
the default (his rationale is here: https://ikiwiki.info/todo/Modern_standard_layout/)

There's a theme OOTB called 'actiontabs' which is more palettable; I
can't find a good example of that in use in the wild. (the thumbnail of
it on the main site is laughably small: https://ikiwiki.info/themes/actiontabs_small.png).

Some other sites I know of running IkiWiki, to give an example of the
extend to which the appearance can vary, are https://anarc.at, https://jmtd.net, https://dep-team.pages.debian.net/ and https://feeding.cloud.geek.nz/ .

Thanks for the suggestion, worth considering.

You're welcome!

--
Please do not CC me for listmail.

👱🏻 Jonathan Dowland
✎ [email protected]
🔗 https://jmtd.net

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