Hello,

I'm a Debian Maintainer with upload permissions for various packages in
the ROCm GPU compute stack. The Debian ROCm Team has a few Sponsored Maintainers contributing to our packages, but is short on Debian
Developers to review them. One of the DDs that I work with has suggested
that I should be reviewing and sponsoring uploads, but I'm not sure that
would be appropriate. The sponsoring process page [1] states:

Remember: Only Debian Developer are allowed to sponsor packages.

The glossary on the wiki [2] also states that a Sponsor is:

A Debian Member with upload privileges

and states that a Debian Member refers to:

Full members of the Debian Project

The entry for Debian Maintainers notes that:

DMs aren't yet members of the Debian Project

This all seems consistent with the theory that it would be inappropriate
for me as a Debian Maintainer to sponsor an upload from a Sponsored
Maintainer, even if I have permission to independently upload my own
changes for that package.

Can anyone confirm one way or another?

Sincerely,
Cory Bloor

[1]: https://mentors.debian.net/sponsors/
[2]: https://wiki.debian.org/Glossary

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On Thu, Jan 16, 2025 at 03:36:15PM -0700, Cordell Bloor wrote:

Hello,

Hi there,

I'm a Debian Maintainer with upload permissions for various packages in the ROCm GPU compute stack. The Debian ROCm Team has a few Sponsored Maintainers contributing to our packages, but is short on Debian Developers to review them. One of the DDs that I work with has suggested that I should be reviewing and sponsoring uploads, but I'm not sure that would be
appropriate. The sponsoring process page [1] states:

Remember: Only Debian Developer are allowed to sponsor packages.

The glossary on the wiki [2] also states that a Sponsor is:

A Debian Member with upload privileges

and states that a Debian Member refers to:

Full members of the Debian Project

The entry for Debian Maintainers notes that:

DMs aren't yet members of the Debian Project

This all seems consistent with the theory that it would be inappropriate for me as a Debian Maintainer to sponsor an upload from a Sponsored Maintainer, even if I have permission to independently upload my own changes for that package.

Can anyone confirm one way or another?

Yes and that anyone will be you.

Just try it and report back.


Upon reporting back: Tell about the package you have in mind. Like RFS.

Sincerely,
Cory Bloor

Groeten
Geert Stappers



[1]: https://mentors.debian.net/sponsors/
[2]: https://wiki.debian.org/Glossary
--
Silence is hard to parse

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On Fri, Jan 17, 2025 at 07:23:51AM +0100, Geert Stappers wrote:

This all seems consistent with the theory that it would be inappropriate for
me as a Debian Maintainer to sponsor an upload from a Sponsored Maintainer, even if I have permission to independently upload my own changes for that package.

Can anyone confirm one way or another?

Yes and that anyone will be you.

Just try it and report back.

(The question, of course, was not about the technical possibility.)

--
WBR, wRAR

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Hi Cordell,

On Thu, Jan 16, 2025 at 03:36:15PM GMT, Cordell Bloor wrote:

Hello,

I'm a Debian Maintainer with upload permissions for various packages in the ROCm GPU compute stack. The Debian ROCm Team has a few Sponsored Maintainers contributing to our packages, but is short on Debian Developers to review them. One of the DDs that I work with has suggested that I should be reviewing and sponsoring uploads, but I'm not sure that would be
appropriate. The sponsoring process page [1] states:

Remember: Only Debian Developer are allowed to sponsor packages.

The glossary on the wiki [2] also states that a Sponsor is:

A Debian Member with upload privileges

and states that a Debian Member refers to:

Full members of the Debian Project

The entry for Debian Maintainers notes that:

DMs aren't yet members of the Debian Project

This all seems consistent with the theory that it would be inappropriate for me as a Debian Maintainer to sponsor an upload from a Sponsored Maintainer, even if I have permission to independently upload my own changes for that package.

Can anyone confirm one way or another?

It is very much appreciated that you were diligent and consulted
documentation (and this list) before trying to sponsor packages as a DM. Technically, it's not possible. See:

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianMaintainer#Granting_Permissions

You can check which packages you have permission to upload here:

https://ftp-master.debian.org/dm.txt

For now, I'd suggest you to become co-maintainer for the packages that
you will be reviewing, ask a DD to give you upload rights for these
packages, and then, as you're in a team, do a team-upload.

https://wiki.debian.org/TeamUpload

Also, if other DDs who work with you think that you are capable of
reviewing and sponsoring packages, you could check what they think about advocating you to become a DD. If you're interested and feel ready for
that too, of course.

Thanks for contributing to Debian.

Bests,

--
Tiago




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Hi Christian,

On Sat, Jan 18, 2025 at 04:55:55PM GMT, Christian Kastner wrote:

Hi Tiago,

On 2025-01-17 14:51, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote:

It is very much appreciated that you were diligent and consulted documentation (and this list) before trying to sponsor packages as a DM. Technically, it's not possible. See:

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianMaintainer#Granting_Permissions

I think there might be a misunderstanding here: the above article is
about granting someone else upload privileges. Whereas here, we have a
DM who already has upload privileges, who would upload a version of a team-maintained package that was prepared by another team member who themselves aren't a DM yet.

Thanks for pointing out. What I understood is that a DD hasn't given
upload privilegies for those packages (because the DM isn't the
maintainer of those packages), but still proposed him to sponsor them.
I assumed that the DD wasn't aware that it wouldn't be possible, but it
seems I was the one who didn't quite understand the question :-)

This obviously cannot be a problem if contributions to the new version
were split 50/50 or even 80/20 between the DM and non-DM, as that is the nature of a team-maintained package.

I posit that it shouldn't be a problem for the DM to upload even in the
0/100 case. If the DM is given trust do to uploads, that implies trust
that the DM will review the uploads, and has the necessary skills to
identify and correct any defects, including those caused by other team members (DD or not).

Yes, that makes sense.

This is just the "formal" view. On a technical level, I don't see what
could stop a DM for going ahead with this regardless, as the only
obstacle could possibly be the Changes line, and the DM could simply
change that before upload.

I don't know how dak works on that level, but yes, worst scenario
changing the Changes would do it (so something like a team-upload in the
end).

Bests,

--
Tiago


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On Sat, Jan 18, 2025 at 02:07:43PM -0500, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote:

It is very much appreciated that you were diligent and consulted documentation (and this list) before trying to sponsor packages as a DM. Technically, it's not possible. See:

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianMaintainer#Granting_Permissions

I think there might be a misunderstanding here: the above article is
about granting someone else upload privileges. Whereas here, we have a
DM who already has upload privileges, who would upload a version of a team-maintained package that was prepared by another team member who themselves aren't a DM yet.

Thanks for pointing out. What I understood is that a DD hasn't given
upload privilegies for those packages (because the DM isn't the
maintainer of those packages), but still proposed him to sponsor them.

"even if I have permission to independently upload my own changes for that package"

--
WBR, wRAR

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