• X.org fork, XLibre

    From Alastair Hogge@21:1/5 to All on Fri Jun 6 16:15:41 2025
    Hello X community,

    tl;dr:
    https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver
    Unfortunate they chose GitHub.

    The following is copied from: https://nitter.net/LundukeJournal/status/1930727192964514137

    Holy smokes, got an exclusive story here that is a BIG one for Linux
    users:

    Xorg is being forked, by the most active Xorg developer, with a first
    release planned later this month.

    And, based on the tentative release notes which The Lunduke Journal got a
    sneak peek at, this looks to be the most significant release of Xorg in years… possibly over a decade.

    Importantly: So this isn’t some fly-by-night fork.

    This fork, named XLibre, is being spearheaded by Enrico Weigelt — who was responsible for 63% of the commits to the Xorg source code repository in
    2024. This is the real deal.

    The Lunduke Journal spoke to Enrico Weigelt to get some additional
    details.

    “For a while we had hoped to get an actual Xorg release, but that's not
    going to happen anymore, so I'm finally going for a full fork,” Enrico stated. “This fork [XLibre] became necessary, because it’s the expressed wish of the current Xorg group's majority to abandon the project, let it
    rot forever, and block any substantial contributions, let alone new
    features. I'm leaving it to the reader to deduce which corporate interests
    are behind that, and instead just moving on.”

    Enrico described the huge number of commits to Xorg which have been simply waiting for a release. In some cases for years. Those changes will
    finally see the light of day with the XLibre fork.

    “First of all, it's the first major Xserver release since 4 years,” said the XLibre lead. “About 3,000 commits waited for release. And hundreds of open merge requests that are shadowbanned by the [corporate Linux] moles.”

    Some of the bigger changes include:

    1) Xnamespace extension: a novel approach for isolating clients from
    different security domains (eg. containers) into separate X11 namespaces,
    where they can't hurt each other (for cases where Xsecurity from 1996
    isn't sufficient).

    2) Xnest ported to xcb - no more dependency on old Xlib anymore.

    3) Per-ABI driver directories (allows distros installing multiple ABIs at
    the same time, eg. for smoother upgrades)

    4) Cleaning up a huge amount of technical debt.

    The XLibre project also says they aim to remedy some of the organizational
    and discrimination issues which have plagued Xorg in recent years.
    Specifically noting that all people are welcome to contribute… regardless
    of their political views.

    “It doesn't matter which country you're coming from, your political views, your race, your sex, your age, your food menu, whether you wear boots or
    heels, whether you're furry or fairy, Conan or McKay, comic character, a
    small furry creature from Alpha Centauri, or just an boring average
    person. Anybody's welcome, who's interested in bringing X forward.”

    The Lunduke Journal will be keeping a close eye on XLibre as it gets
    closer to their first planned release, currently scheduled for later in
    June. While many Linux distributions have moved to Wayland as an Xorg replacement… there remains a large majority of software which is reliant
    on Xorg, and many users who prefer it over Wayland (for a variety of
    reasons and use cases).

    As such it is reassuring to see a viable fork of Xorg, by an established, prominent developer.


    --
    To health and anarchy

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  • From Eli the Bearded@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Fri Jun 6 18:08:41 2025
    In comp.windows.x, Alastair Hogge <[email protected]> wrote:
    Hello X community,

    tl;dr:
    https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver
    Unfortunate they chose GitHub.

    The following is copied from: https://nitter.net/LundukeJournal/status/1930727192964514137

    See also:

    https://lists.x.org/archives/xorg-devel/2025-June/059396.html

    It's an interesting development.

    Elijah
    ------
    still prefers X11 to Wayland

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Computer Nerd Kev@21:1/5 to Alastair Hogge on Sat Jun 7 10:57:46 2025
    Alastair Hogge <[email protected]> wrote:
    Hello X community,

    tl;dr:
    https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver
    Unfortunate they chose GitHub.

    The following is copied from: https://nitter.net/LundukeJournal/status/1930727192964514137

    Holy smokes, got an exclusive story here that is a BIG one for Linux
    users:

    Xorg is being forked, by the most active Xorg developer, with a first
    release planned later this month.

    It'll be interesting to see whether many distros make packages for
    it (including separate driver packages because the README notes
    that X.Org drivers aren't binary compatible).

    --
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  • From Alastair Hogge@21:1/5 to Computer Nerd Kev on Sun Jun 8 05:30:58 2025
    On Sat, 07 Jun 2025 10:57:46 +1000, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

    Alastair Hogge <[email protected]> wrote:
    Hello X community,

    tl;dr:
    https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver Unfortunate they chose GitHub.

    The following is copied from:
    https://nitter.net/LundukeJournal/status/1930727192964514137

    Holy smokes, got an exclusive story here that is a BIG one for Linux
    users:

    Xorg is being forked, by the most active Xorg developer, with a first
    release planned later this month.

    It'll be interesting to see whether many distros make packages for it (including separate driver packages because the README notes that X.Org drivers aren't binary compatible).

    Am I missing something? From the README.md:

    Module ABIs have changed - drivers MUST be recompiled against this
    Xserver verison, otherwise the Xserver can crash or not even start up correctly.

    Most xorg drivers should run as-is (need recompile!), with some
    exceptions. See .gitlab-ci.yml for the versions/branches built along
    w/ Xlibre.

    --
    To health and anarchy

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Computer Nerd Kev@21:1/5 to Alastair Hogge on Sun Jun 8 17:21:00 2025
    Alastair Hogge <[email protected]> wrote:
    On Sat, 07 Jun 2025 10:57:46 +1000, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
    It'll be interesting to see whether many distros make packages for it
    (including separate driver packages because the README notes that X.Org
    drivers aren't binary compatible).

    Am I missing something? From the README.md:

    Module ABIs have changed - drivers MUST be recompiled against this
    Xserver verison, otherwise the Xserver can crash or not even start up
    correctly.

    Most xorg drivers should run as-is (need recompile!), with some
    exceptions. See .gitlab-ci.yml for the versions/branches built along
    w/ Xlibre.

    I read that as: the code for the drivers doesn't usually need to be
    changed, but they need to be recompiled, so existing X.Org driver
    packages won't work. Same as with Linux kernel drivers.

    I suspect distro package maintainers won't consider it worth that
    much effort given how many separate X packages they usually have.

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  • From Lawrence D'Oliveiro@21:1/5 to Computer Nerd Kev on Mon Jun 9 00:28:39 2025
    On 8 Jun 2025 17:21:00 +1000, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

    I read that as: the code for the drivers doesn't usually need to be
    changed, but they need to be recompiled, so existing X.Org driver
    packages won't work. Same as with Linux kernel drivers.

    It is not the kernel that calls into the X server, it is the X server that calls into the kernel. So I wouldn’t expect any kernel changes to be necessary.

    I suspect distro package maintainers won't consider it worth that
    much effort given how many separate X packages they usually have.

    There aren’t that many different driver add-on packages, are there?

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  • From Computer Nerd Kev@21:1/5 to Lawrence D'Oliveiro on Mon Jun 9 17:18:14 2025
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro <[email protected]d> wrote:
    On 8 Jun 2025 17:21:00 +1000, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
    I read that as: the code for the drivers doesn't usually need to be
    changed, but they need to be recompiled, so existing X.Org driver
    packages won't work. Same as with Linux kernel drivers.

    It is not the kernel that calls into the X server, it is the X server that calls into the kernel. So I wouldn't expect any kernel changes to be necessary.

    I mean the situation is the same as with Linux kernel drivers, not
    that Linux kernel drivers also need to be changed. The X server is
    modular like the kernel, so like a new kernel needs new module
    builds to be sure of avoiding errors, so apparantly does this X
    server. But I just mentioned kernel drivers as an example.

    I suspect distro package maintainers won't consider it worth that
    much effort given how many separate X packages they usually have.

    There aren't that many different driver add-on packages, are there?

    On Devuan:
    $ aptitude search xserver-xorg-input xserver-xorg-video | wc -l
    42

    But other distros might have fewer.

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