https://www.theguardian.com/money/article/2024/jul/13/mobile-banking-fraudsters-accounts-scams-refund-victims
"Mobile banking: alarm as fraudsters take over handsets and raid accounts
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
On 13.07.24 15:42, Andy Burns wrote:
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
David Wade <[email protected]d> wrote:
On 13/07/2024 15:17, J�rg Lorenz wrote:
On 13.07.24 15:42, Andy Burns wrote:
J�rg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken >>>>> over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they >>>> can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Well that lets you onto the phone but most banking apps require the user
re-authenticate after switching to a different app. I suppose you can
then reset access to the passwords.
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for (banking) apps
so the thief videos you typing in your code and then steals the phone. Now >they get access to your phone AND money.
On Sat, 13 Jul 2024 14:42:31 +0100, Andy Burns <[email protected]>
wrote:
J�rg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Or kidnap the owner and torture them till they reveal the passwords.
I don't have a banking app on my phone, partly for that reason, and
partly because there's no room.
One time in Little Rock, I lost half my wallet**, the half with
cards, and only had a small amount of money left.
In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 13 Jul 2024 18:45:12 -0000 (UTC), Chris <[email protected]> wrote:
David Wade <[email protected]d> wrote:
On 13/07/2024 15:17, Jörg Lorenz wrote:
On 13.07.24 15:42, Andy Burns wrote:
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken >>>>>> over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they >>>>> can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Well that lets you onto the phone but most banking apps require the user >>> re-authenticate after switching to a different app. I suppose you can
That's a no-brainer. Just snatch the phone when he's using the banking
app.
then reset access to the passwords.
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for (banking) apps
Really? I would never do that. If I had a phone passcode it would be
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if
they can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
I know I did until I started reading about these types of thefts.
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
I know I did until I started reading about these types of thefts.
On 7/13/2024 4:20 PM, Chris wrote:
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
The link is locked for me...
On 7/13/2024 12:10 PM, micky wrote:
One time in Little Rock, I lost half my wallet**, the half with
cards, and only had a small amount of money left.
On trips I used to keep emergency cash hidden under the floormat in the
car. Luckily I never needed it. I came close to forgetting about it one
time when I got home and put the car through the full service car
wash though... 8-O
micky <[email protected]> wrote:
In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 13 Jul 2024 18:45:12 -0000 (UTC), Chris
<[email protected]> wrote:
David Wade <[email protected]d> wrote:
On 13/07/2024 15:17, J�rg Lorenz wrote:
On 13.07.24 15:42, Andy Burns wrote:
J�rg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken >>>>>>> over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they >>>>>> can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Well that lets you onto the phone but most banking apps require the user >>>> re-authenticate after switching to a different app. I suppose you can
That's a no-brainer. Just snatch the phone when he's using the banking
app.
How would a thief know?
victim
for 20 years I carried 60 dollars in travelers checks in the trunk,
but I stopped. I've thought about starting again.
On 2024-07-13 17:06, AJL wrote:
On 7/13/2024 4:20 PM, Chris wrote:
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
The link is locked for me...
Try this:
<https://archive.is/OsN5j>
On 7/13/2024 5:44 PM, micky wrote:
for 20 years I carried 60 dollars in travelers checks in the trunk,
but I stopped. I've thought about starting again.
Travelers checks?? My emergency stash hidden under the floormat was
cash cause everybody takes cash...
On 7/13/2024 5:17 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2024-07-13 17:06, AJL wrote:
On 7/13/2024 4:20 PM, Chris wrote:
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
The link is locked for me...
Try this:
<https://archive.is/OsN5j>
That link worked. Interesting article. I also live in a large metro area (Phoenix AZ US) and the same stuff happens here.
But you said: "Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as
for (banking) apps" and I saw nothing in that piece to verify that.
"Most" being over half the phone using population. I still doubt that assertion but also can't prove otherwise...
On 2024-07-13 18:39, AJL wrote:
But you said: "Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as
for (banking) apps" and I saw nothing in that piece to verify that.
"Most" being over half the phone using population. I still doubt that
assertion but also can't prove otherwise...
I didn't say that.
Sorry.
On 7/13/2024 6:45 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2024-07-13 18:39, AJL wrote:
But you said: "Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as
for (banking) apps" and I saw nothing in that piece to verify that.
"Most" being over half the phone using population. I still doubt that
assertion but also can't prove otherwise...
I didn't say that.
Sorry.
Ah. My error. Apologies...
In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 13 Jul 2024 18:39:43 -0700, AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 5:44 PM, micky wrote:
for 20 years I carried 60 dollars in travelers checks in the
trunk, but I stopped. I've thought about starting again.
Travelers checks?? My emergency stash hidden under the floormat
was cash cause everybody takes cash...
I thought about that. Would the police take traveler's checks?.
of course it's not just traffic tickets that can cause one to really
need money.
On 7/13/2024 6:49 PM, micky wrote:
In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 13 Jul 2024 18:39:43 -0700, AJL
<[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 5:44 PM, micky wrote:
for 20 years I carried 60 dollars in travelers checks in the
trunk, but I stopped. I've thought about starting again.
Travelers checks?? My emergency stash hidden under the floormat
was cash cause everybody takes cash...
I thought about that. Would the police take traveler's checks?.
Depends on where you are I imagine. I do know that in Phoenix a normal >speeding citation requires only a signature, no matter where you're from...
of course it's not just traffic tickets that can cause one to really
need money.
I always carry cash just in case the cards didn't work. More than once
it's saved me when a store's system was down and they only took cash...
David Wade <[email protected]d> wrote:
On 13/07/2024 15:17, Jörg Lorenz wrote:
On 13.07.24 15:42, Andy Burns wrote:
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken >>>>> over. Not very helpful.
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they >>>> can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Well that lets you onto the phone but most banking apps require the user
re-authenticate after switching to a different app. I suppose you can
then reset access to the passwords.
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for (banking) apps
so the thief videos you typing in your code and then steals the phone. Now they get access to your phone AND money.
On 7/13/2024 11:45 AM, Chris wrote:
Most people use the same passcode on the lock screen as for
(banking) apps
I doubt that. Any links...
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/13/2024 4:20 PM, Chris wrote:
Bank apps ask you to set a PIN as an added level of security.
People are lazy and don't want to remember another PIN so use the
same one as the phone lock screen.
Depends on the bank app. Mine don't offer pin capability but do
require long passwords using all types of characters.
That's sounds like a PITA.
On 13.07.24 12:58, Java Jive wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/money/article/2024/jul/13/mobile-banking-fraudsters-accounts-scams-refund-victims
"Mobile banking: alarm as fraudsters take over handsets and raid accounts
The article is extremely unspecific how the accounts/mobiles were taken
over. Not very helpful.
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
On 7/14/2024 2:24 AM, Chris wrote:
AJL <[email protected]> wrote:
Mine [bank apps] don't offer pin capability but do require long
passwords using all types of characters.
That's sounds like a PITA.
PITA? Not for me. Because I'm one of those paranoid folks who don't
keep any banking (or investment) apps on my phone for security
reasons.
The topic is mobile banking...
As far a pin vs password I find passwords easier. That's because I
use a formula for each site. Something like $ + my first employee
number + first 3 letters of site/app name + my second employee
number + next 2 letters of the site/app name + the number 13. This
is just an example and it can give me a 15+ character password that
I can easily remember and type in in a just few seconds.
Some sites don't accept passwords longer than 8 or 9 chars and/or no
special character. What do you do then?
I gave up years ago and have a password manager.
Much easier. Only one password to remember.
Andy Burns wrote:That's a warning doing the rounds over here, approach someone, convince
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
Not the same thing. Bank apps ask you to set a PIN as an added level of security. People are lazy and don't want to remember another PIN so use the same one as the phone lock screen.
Chris wrote:Go to google, search for 26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
https://www.ft.com/content/26be349d-4717-4815-a221-a749e29de2b2
The link is locked for me...
Jörg Lorenz wrote:
Andy Burns wrote:That's a warning doing the rounds over here, approach someone, convince
Snatch the unlocked phone from the user's hands. Bonus points if they
can trick the owner into unlocking it, and then snatching it
Seriously?
them they're cute, ask them to add you to their contacts, when they get
their phone out and unlock it, steal it.
Newspapers with stories of individuals stealing a dozens of phones per
hour, in city centres or at festivals.
On 14/07/2024 00:20, Chris wrote:
Not the same thing. Bank apps ask you to set a PIN as an added
level of security. People are lazy and don't want to remember
another PIN so use the same one as the phone lock screen.
I have no idea why the banks have recently made the security of their
apps weaker. I have two banking apps on my phone, each of them used
to have a longish alphanumeric password that I had chosen (two
different passwords of course). But recent compulsory "upgrades" to
each App have made me chose a 5-digit or 6-digit PIN. I have chosen different PINs and neither is the same as the one I use to unlock the
phone, but all the same it's obviously less secure than before. Can
anyone think why on earth they have done that? It seems crazy to me.
On Mon, 15 Jul 2024 14:48:38 +0100
Clive Page <[email protected]> wrote:
On 14/07/2024 00:20, Chris wrote:
Not the same thing. Bank apps ask you to set a PIN as an added
level of security. People are lazy and don't want to remember
another PIN so use the same one as the phone lock screen.
I have no idea why the banks have recently made the security of their
apps weaker. I have two banking apps on my phone, each of them used
to have a longish alphanumeric password that I had chosen (two
different passwords of course). But recent compulsory "upgrades" to
each App have made me chose a 5-digit or 6-digit PIN. I have chosen
different PINs and neither is the same as the one I use to unlock the
phone, but all the same it's obviously less secure than before. Can
anyone think why on earth they have done that? It seems crazy to me.
What is the banks' explanation?
On Mon, 15 Jul 2024 14:48:38 +0100
Clive Page <[email protected]> wrote:
On 14/07/2024 00:20, Chris wrote:
Not the same thing. Bank apps ask you to set a PIN as an added
level of security. People are lazy and don't want to remember
another PIN so use the same one as the phone lock screen.
I have no idea why the banks have recently made the security of their
apps weaker. I have two banking apps on my phone, each of them used
to have a longish alphanumeric password that I had chosen (two
different passwords of course). But recent compulsory "upgrades" to
each App have made me chose a 5-digit or 6-digit PIN. I have chosen
different PINs and neither is the same as the one I use to unlock the
phone, but all the same it's obviously less secure than before. Can
anyone think why on earth they have done that? It seems crazy to me.
What is the banks' explanation?
It’s usually a sim swap fraud. Somehow convince the mobile operator to port the number to another mobile operator where the new sim is in the
possession of the fraudster.
Tweed wrote:
It’s usually a sim swap fraud. Somehow convince the mobile operator to port
the number to another mobile operator where the new sim is in the
possession of the fraudster.
Whenever I've requested porting my number to a different operator, I've >received texts giving 24 or more hours notice to port.
Which operators *don't* operate such a safeguard?
Andy Burns <[email protected]> wrote:
Which operators *don't* operate such a safeguard?>The fraudsters phone pretending to be the operator, to say that they
have had a SIM-swap request.
The fraudsters phone pretending to be the operator, to say that they
have had a SIM-swap request.
I have no idea why the banks have recently made the security of their apps weaker. I have two banking apps on my phone, each of them used to have a longish alphanumeric password that I had chosen (two different passwords of course). But recentcompulsory "upgrades" to each App have made me chose a 5-digit or 6-digit PIN. I have chosen different PINs and neither is the same as the one I use to unlock the phone, but all the same it's obviously less secure than before. Can anyone think why on
On Mon, 15 Jul 2024 14:48:38 +0100, Clive Page <[email protected]>compulsory "upgrades" to each App have made me chose a 5-digit or 6-digit PIN. I have chosen different PINs and neither is the same as the one I use to unlock the phone, but all the same it's obviously less secure than before. Can anyone think why on
wrote:
I have no idea why the banks have recently made the security of their apps weaker. I have two banking apps on my phone, each of them used to have a longish alphanumeric password that I had chosen (two different passwords of course). But recent
If people are required to use complex passwords it's unlikely they'llWell that is possible, but I have no idea if it is true. But in that case, people like me who can memorize a few alphanumeric passwords should not be forced to switch instead to a set of 5-digit or 6-digit numbers instead. I think I'd like the choice
be able to memorize them, so will often write them down. People are
much more likely to be able to memorize a 6-digit password.
So the reduced security of a simple password is more than outweighed
by the risk of people writing a password down.
Chris
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