• Re: DD correctly emulated by HHH --- Totally ignoring invalid rebuttals

    From Richard Heathfield@21:1/5 to Bonita Montero on Tue Mar 4 10:16:11 2025
    XPost: comp.theory, comp.lang.c++

    On 04/03/2025 10:06, Bonita Montero wrote:

    <snip>


    You're wrong; your program will never stop

    Yes, it will.

    - like
    your halting problem investigations.

    Patience, patience. That, too, will stop... eventually.

    --
    Richard Heathfield
    Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
    "Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
    Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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  • From Richard Damon@21:1/5 to olcott on Tue Mar 4 07:29:59 2025
    XPost: comp.theory, comp.lang.c++

    On 3/3/25 10:07 PM, olcott wrote:
    int DD()
    {
      int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
      if (Halt_Status)
        HERE: goto HERE;
      return Halt_Status;
    }

    _DD()
    [00002133] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
    [00002134] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping
    [00002136] 51         push ecx      ; make space for local [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD
    [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD)
    [00002141] 83c404     add esp,+04
    [00002144] 8945fc     mov [ebp-04],eax
    [00002147] 837dfc00   cmp dword [ebp-04],+00
    [0000214b] 7402       jz 0000214f
    [0000214d] ebfe       jmp 0000214d
    [0000214f] 8b45fc     mov eax,[ebp-04]
    [00002152] 8be5       mov esp,ebp
    [00002154] 5d         pop ebp
    [00002155] c3         ret
    Size in bytes:(0035) [00002155]

    DD correctly emulated by HHH cannot possibly
    reach its own "ret" instruction and terminate normally.

    And the HHH that correctly emulated DD, can't be a decider and answer.

    Also. "the HHH", defined in your Halt7.c doesn't do that, so your claim
    is based on the belief in a Truth Fairy that can make false statements true.


    The only valid rebuttal is to show all of the steps of
    exactly how DD correctly emulated by HHH reaches its
    own "ret" instruction.


    Nope, *YOU* the one making the claims, need to show your proof, and
    answer the questions.

    Your failure to do so is just an admission thaty you KNOW you ar just a
    liar and are deliberately makeing up stuff.

    Some of the big ones that you are admitting to be errors because you do
    not answer them:

    How can HHH's simulation of the HHH called by DD be correct when it
    doesn't match the trace of the execution of the outer HHH, but judt
    stops the simulation claiming something that has not been proven?

    If the behavior of a program can depend on its execution context, as you
    claim, then where is the first instruction, correctly simulated, where
    that difference occurs? This simple fact just proves that you are
    totally ignorant of the basics of Computing, and are working in some hair-brained logic system that isn't valid.

    How can HHH be a proper "Pure Program" and still emulate the input you
    claim to be giving it?

    Remember, Pure Programs are not allowed to look at any data that isn't
    part of their input or derived from their processing of it.

    So, If the input is exactly what you show, how can HHH continue past the
    Call HHH instruction as REQURIED to be a correct emulator when the data
    isn't there.

    If we include the code for HHH as part of the input, your claim that HHH
    is just an emulator is proven FALSE, as the HHH that is there is the
    decider that WILL abort its processing an return.

    IF HHH is going to emulate the call based on just a description of HHH,
    then it needs to be a correct description, and since this HHH WILL abort
    and return, the description of the HHH that DD calls must also be that
    it will do that, and thus you claims are shown to be just pure lies.

    In all, all you have done is proved that you are ignorant of what you
    talk about, not understand even the basic definitons and rules of the
    system, but just don't care, because it seems, you are nothing but a pathological liar that has a reckless disregard for the truth.

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  • From Richard Damon@21:1/5 to olcott on Tue Mar 4 07:30:00 2025
    XPost: comp.theory, comp.lang.c++

    No, your are just totally ignoring the ERRORS and LIES pointed out in
    your arguement, because you just don't care about what is true, but are
    just a pathological liar with a reckess


    On 3/3/25 10:07 PM, olcott wrote:
    int DD()
    {
      int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
      if (Halt_Status)
        HERE: goto HERE;
      return Halt_Status;
    }

    _DD()
    [00002133] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
    [00002134] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping
    [00002136] 51         push ecx      ; make space for local [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD
    [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD)
    [00002141] 83c404     add esp,+04
    [00002144] 8945fc     mov [ebp-04],eax
    [00002147] 837dfc00   cmp dword [ebp-04],+00
    [0000214b] 7402       jz 0000214f
    [0000214d] ebfe       jmp 0000214d
    [0000214f] 8b45fc     mov eax,[ebp-04]
    [00002152] 8be5       mov esp,ebp
    [00002154] 5d         pop ebp
    [00002155] c3         ret
    Size in bytes:(0035) [00002155]

    DD correctly emulated by HHH cannot possibly
    reach its own "ret" instruction and terminate normally.

    And that DD can not be "correctly emualted" by HHH, as it isn't a
    complete program.

    When you include HHH in that code, we first find that you currect design
    of HHH doesn't "correctly emulate" its input, but aborts it based on a
    false assumption about what the input does.

    And, if we change HHH to meet that specification, YOU have proven that
    it will not answer, and thus not be a decider.

    The problem is you don't understand the question your HHH is supposed to
    be answering, but have replaced it with a strawman, and apparently you
    have straw for your brain.


    The only valid rebuttal is to show all of the steps of
    exactly how DD correctly emulated by HHH reaches its
    own "ret" instruction.


    Nope, YOU need to show that you understand the errors you dismissed.

    All you are doing is proving that you are just a ignorant pathological
    lying idiot with a reckless disregard for the truth,

    That will be how you are remembered for eternity,

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  • From Richard Heathfield@21:1/5 to olcott on Tue Mar 4 14:47:34 2025
    XPost: comp.theory, comp.lang.c++

    On 04/03/2025 14:32, olcott wrote:
    The only valid rebuttal is to show all of the steps of
    exactly how DD correctly emulated by HHH reaches its
    own "ret" instruction.

    If that is the only rebuttal you are prepared to accept as valid, congratulations! You have solved the Halting Problem entirely to
    your own satisfaction.

    If you want to be recognised for your breakthrough, however, it
    is not enough that nobody should convince you that you're wrong;
    you have to convince others that you're right, and that means
    explaining exactly why their criticisms are ill-founded. Saying
    "I'm right and I won't listen to anyone claiming otherwise" lacks
    explanatory power.

    F'ups set.

    --
    Richard Heathfield
    Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
    "Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
    Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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  • From Richard Damon@21:1/5 to olcott on Tue Mar 4 18:45:22 2025
    XPost: comp.theory, comp.lang.c++

    On 3/4/25 9:32 AM, olcott wrote:
    On 3/4/2025 6:29 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
    On 3/3/25 10:07 PM, olcott wrote:
    int DD()
    {
       int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
       if (Halt_Status)
         HERE: goto HERE;
       return Halt_Status;
    }

    _DD()
    [00002133] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
    [00002134] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping
    [00002136] 51         push ecx      ; make space for local
    [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD
    [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD)
    [00002141] 83c404     add esp,+04
    [00002144] 8945fc     mov [ebp-04],eax
    [00002147] 837dfc00   cmp dword [ebp-04],+00
    [0000214b] 7402       jz 0000214f
    [0000214d] ebfe       jmp 0000214d
    [0000214f] 8b45fc     mov eax,[ebp-04]
    [00002152] 8be5       mov esp,ebp
    [00002154] 5d         pop ebp
    [00002155] c3         ret
    Size in bytes:(0035) [00002155]

    DD correctly emulated by HHH cannot possibly
    reach its own "ret" instruction and terminate normally.

    *Proves that the input to HHH(DD) can be rejected as non-halting*

    No, it proves that the HHH that rejects the input, didn't do a correct simulation, and thus was looking at the wrong input, because you don't understand what a program is.

    DD only is non-halting if *THE* HHH (and there is only one at any time)
    never aborts. SInce HHH musts abort its emulation to "reject" the input,
    it proves it didn't do the needed correct emulation, and you are shown
    to be just a blantant liar.



    And the HHH that correctly emulated DD, can't be a decider and answer.

    Also. "the HHH", defined in your Halt7.c doesn't do that,

    The only valid rebuttal is to show all of the steps of
    exactly how DD correctly emulated by HHH reaches its
    own "ret" instruction.

    Failing to provide the above proves that you are clueless
    about this code.


    Nope, I have shown why your logic is wrong, and your insistance on a
    strawman just proves you just have straw for brains.

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