• Energy used in a horizontal hold - timed weightlifting

    From Dave@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jul 8 12:12:29 2024
    XPost: sci.physics, uk.politics.misc

    Here's a very simple question:
    How do you calculate the energy used by a sportsperson with a timed
    horizonal hold? You hold out a 10kg kettlebell (women) or a 18kg
    kettlebell (men) horizontally in front of you for as long as possible,
    and the person who hold it out longest wins.

    Obviously the longer you hold, the harder it gets until it's torture
    from lactic acid build up, and you give up.

    The physics I've been taught has no anwser, since energy is newton
    meters. I'm politely suggesting that the energy unit needs a
    rework to include time, and per relativity spacetime.

    Said spectacle isn't in competition so much, too many awkward
    questions? Answer from bad or stupid teachers is:
    "You're not making any sense. Energy is force times distance".

    Some videos talk about specific impulse, which is force times
    time, but this isn't worked into anything else.

    To make the competition even between long arm and short arm people,
    it may be fairer to hold it out for a set distance, not with
    locked elbows.

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  • From Jim Pennino@21:1/5 to Dave on Mon Jul 8 08:53:16 2024
    XPost: sci.physics, uk.politics.misc

    In sci.physics Dave <[email protected]> wrote:
    Here's a very simple question:
    How do you calculate the energy used by a sportsperson with a timed
    horizonal hold? You hold out a 10kg kettlebell (women) or a 18kg
    kettlebell (men) horizontally in front of you for as long as possible,
    and the person who hold it out longest wins.

    Obviously the longer you hold, the harder it gets until it's torture
    from lactic acid build up, and you give up.

    The physics I've been taught has no anwser, since energy is newton
    meters. I'm politely suggesting that the energy unit needs a
    rework to include time, and per relativity spacetime.

    Said spectacle isn't in competition so much, too many awkward
    questions? Answer from bad or stupid teachers is:
    "You're not making any sense. Energy is force times distance".

    Some videos talk about specific impulse, which is force times
    time, but this isn't worked into anything else.

    To make the competition even between long arm and short arm people,
    it may be fairer to hold it out for a set distance, not with
    locked elbows.

    You are conflating physics and physiology.

    Replace the biological entity with a wooden cross and you have the
    answer from physics, i.e. zero energy is used.

    To get an answer from physiology you need to understand how muscles
    work.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From bertietaylor@21:1/5 to Dave on Tue Jul 9 08:33:26 2024
    XPost: sci.physics, uk.politics.misc

    On Mon, 8 Jul 2024 11:12:29 +0000, Dave wrote:

    Here's a very simple question:
    How do you calculate the energy used by a sportsperson with a timed
    horizonal hold? You hold out a 10kg kettlebell (women) or a 18kg
    kettlebell (men) horizontally in front of you for as long as possible,
    and the person who hold it out longest wins.

    Obviously the longer you hold, the harder it gets until it's torture
    from lactic acid build up, and you give up.

    The physics I've been taught has no anwser, since energy is newton
    meters. I'm politely suggesting that the energy unit needs a
    rework to include time, and per relativity spacetime.

    Said spectacle isn't in competition so much, too many awkward
    questions? Answer from bad or stupid teachers is:
    "You're not making any sense. Energy is force times distance".

    Some videos talk about specific impulse, which is force times
    time, but this isn't worked into anything else.

    To make the competition even between long arm and short arm people,
    it may be fairer to hold it out for a set distance, not with
    locked elbows.

    Energy is force times distance so in your case while there is force it
    does not move anything so energy expended is zero.
    The force causes the muscles to tire.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Dave@21:1/5 to Dave on Tue Jul 9 10:37:48 2024
    XPost: sci.physics, uk.politics.misc

    On 24 29, Dave wrote:
    Here's a very simple question:
    How do you calculate the energy used by a sportsperson with a timed
    horizonal hold? You hold out a 10kg kettlebell (women) or a 18kg
    kettlebell (men) horizontally in front of you for as long as possible,
    and the person who hold it out longest wins.

    Obviously the longer you hold, the harder it gets until it's torture
    from lactic acid build up, and you give up.

    The physics I've been taught has no anwser, since energy is newton
    meters. I'm politely suggesting that the energy unit needs a
    rework to include time, and per relativity spacetime.

    Said spectacle isn't in competition so much, too many awkward
    questions? Answer from bad or stupid teachers is:
    "You're not making any sense. Energy is force times distance".

    Some videos talk about specific impulse, which is force times
    time, but this isn't worked into anything else.

    To make the competition even between long arm and short arm people,
    it may be fairer to hold it out for a set distance, not with
    locked elbows.
    After thinking about this some more, it's not so easy. Obviously you
    are using energy, from the force you need to apply, or otherwise.
    Not adding energy to the kettlebell.

    Best to reformulate the problem and use calculus. The reformulation
    is to assume you're moving the weight up in an semicircle arc,
    180 degrees, and take results from the force at the pivot,
    i.e. your shoulders. Then use calculus to see the power in watts
    for the lift needed when your arms are horizontal, and multiply this
    by time.

    A very interesting question in a 3 hour exam, this being one of the
    three quesions. The marks and time given is the only hint it's
    not a two line answer in words. Not reformulation, just the original
    on the exam paper. Depending on the culture, might be the homework
    for the week.

    You don't get TV to this level in edutainment programmes in the UK,
    (or US?), but Indian English language programming? They don't mind
    equations in the Times of India (as 2006).

    Haven't done the sums, might be a good question for AI. E.g. if
    you're not wanting it too smart, nothing ever gets typed into a
    computer, or digital photos taken by recent devices. A pre 2009
    compact camera and an old pre 2004 desktop (not networked),
    if in a well screened Faraday cage with an independent power
    supply, may be OK. Use a typewriter?

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