• New business grade computer recommendations?

    From T@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 29 16:34:03 2025
    Hi All,

    I have been recommending Lenovo's Think Station computer
    to customers. But I really do not like how proprietary
    they are. Repairing them is impossible after the warranty
    period expires as Lenovo is the only source of parts
    and Lenovo won't sell you parts after the warranty expires.

    To name a few:

    Proprietary connectors on the motherboard to the SATA
    drives (power and data). (Motherboard SATA pins that
    you have never seen before.)

    Front panels that can not be removed to insert things like
    powered front panel hubs and DVD drives.

    Proprietary power supplies with proprietary power connectors.

    Proprietary dimensions on motherboards (not ATX, ITX
    or anything recognizable).

    On the bright side, Lenovo's Think Stations are pretty
    reliable. Just hope they don't break.

    I have seen recommendations for Dell, but I have not had
    great experiences will Dell in the past, especially their
    habit of putting intermittent motherboards down the parts
    cleaner and reissuing them a spare parts.

    Anyone have a recommendation for a business grade
    computers that use generic parts and are very reliable?

    Many thanks,
    -T

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From sticks@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 29 18:48:42 2025
    On 8/29/2025 6:34 PM, T wrote:
    Hi All,

    I have been recommending Lenovo's Think Station computer
    to customers.   But I really do not like how proprietary
    they are.  Repairing them is impossible after the warranty
    period expires as Lenovo is the only source of parts
    and Lenovo won't sell you parts after the warranty expires.

    To name a few:

        Proprietary connectors on the motherboard to the SATA
        drives (power and data).  (Motherboard SATA pins that
        you have never seen before.)

        Front panels that can not be removed to insert things like
        powered front panel hubs and DVD drives.

        Proprietary power supplies with proprietary power connectors.

        Proprietary dimensions on motherboards (not ATX, ITX
        or anything recognizable).

    On the bright side, Lenovo's Think Stations are pretty
    reliable.  Just hope they don't break.

    I have seen recommendations for Dell, but I have not had
    great experiences will Dell in the past, especially their
    habit of putting intermittent motherboards down the parts
    cleaner and reissuing them a spare parts.

    Anyone have a recommendation for a business grade
    computers that use generic parts and are very reliable?

    Many thanks,
    -T

    I really like the HP workstation line. I got one for my son in the
    HP-Z2 line, and for myself I went a little less on the features that he
    had and got one in the HP-Z1 line. What I really like are the way the
    cases open up and accept additional hardware, or just being able to work
    on them easily. They are quite good.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From sticks@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 29 19:50:58 2025
    On 8/29/2025 7:15 PM, T wrote:
    On 8/29/25 4:48 PM, sticks wrote:
    I really like the HP workstation line.  I got one for my son in the
    HP- Z2 line, and for myself I went a little less on the features that
    he had and got one in the HP-Z1 line.  What I really like are the way
    the cases open up and accept additional hardware, or just being able
    to work on them easily.  They are quite good.

    I had a customer that bough a bunch of HP for their business.
    They got a really deal with a 12 month warranty.  They all
    broke at 13 months.  I repaired them -- mostly bad drives.
    I am a little leery of HP ever since.

    Hopefully with your experience, they have cleaned up
    their act.  Then again, I am pretty sure they were
    home grade computers.

    Well the son does programming for CNC work. It works the hell out of
    the computer when he is doing his modeling. It originally only had 16G
    of ram and I upgraded it to 32G. You could really feel the difference
    and it completely stopped chugging along, like when you would rotate the
    model or change an variable and ask it to redraw. It just popped.

    Even my Z1 I am very pleased with. Kinda funny but out in my shop where
    I spend most of my time I use a cheap $50 20 year old Compaq desktop
    running win 10 and only use the desktop HP in the evening for a short
    time. The garage box is amazingly stable and works well, but it's like
    going to another level with that Z2.

    I did a quick look at the current HP lineup, and it looks like you could
    really get amazing things, if you have the money. That's the problem.
    Every time I go to buy something, I tell myself I don't need to have top
    of the line, but when I go look I change my mind and think I really do
    kind of want that. HP does have a good group of price ranges to get
    started, and you can go from there.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From T@21:1/5 to sticks on Fri Aug 29 17:15:54 2025
    On 8/29/25 4:48 PM, sticks wrote:
    I really like the HP workstation line.  I got one for my son in the HP-
    Z2 line, and for myself I went a little less on the features that he had
    and got one in the HP-Z1 line.  What I really like are the way the cases open up and accept additional hardware, or just being able to work on
    them easily.  They are quite good.

    I had a customer that bough a bunch of HP for their business.
    They got a really deal with a 12 month warranty. They all
    broke at 13 months. I repaired them -- mostly bad drives.
    I am a little leery of HP ever since.

    Hopefully with your experience, they have cleaned up
    their act. Then again, I am pretty sure they were
    home grade computers.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From [email protected]@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Fri Aug 29 21:03:19 2025
    On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 16:34:03 -0700, T <[email protected]d> wrote:

    Hi All,

    I have been recommending Lenovo's Think Station computer
    to customers. But I really do not like how proprietary
    they are. Repairing them is impossible after the warranty
    period expires as Lenovo is the only source of parts
    and Lenovo won't sell you parts after the warranty expires.

    To name a few:

    Proprietary connectors on the motherboard to the SATA
    drives (power and data). (Motherboard SATA pins that
    you have never seen before.)

    Front panels that can not be removed to insert things like
    powered front panel hubs and DVD drives.

    Proprietary power supplies with proprietary power connectors.

    Proprietary dimensions on motherboards (not ATX, ITX
    or anything recognizable).

    On the bright side, Lenovo's Think Stations are pretty
    reliable. Just hope they don't break.

    I have seen recommendations for Dell, but I have not had
    great experiences will Dell in the past, especially their
    habit of putting intermittent motherboards down the parts
    cleaner and reissuing them a spare parts.

    Anyone have a recommendation for a business grade
    computers that use generic parts and are very reliable?

    Many thanks,
    -T



    Not in any way an answer to your question - but -
    I wonder how anyone can sell new Lenovo desktops
    when the refurb units are ~ $ 200.

    I know - apples and oranges, but this unit is $ 230 _Canadian_

    https://www.infotechcomputers.ca/product/lenovo-thinkcentre-m710s-i7-16gb-desktop/

    I've bought 2 Lenovo laptops from these guys - they're legit.
    John T.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From sticks@21:1/5 to [email protected] on Fri Aug 29 21:00:09 2025
    On 8/29/2025 8:03 PM, [email protected] wrote:
    On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 16:34:03 -0700, T <[email protected]d> wrote:

    Hi All,

    I have been recommending Lenovo's Think Station computer
    to customers. But I really do not like how proprietary
    they are. Repairing them is impossible after the warranty
    period expires as Lenovo is the only source of parts
    and Lenovo won't sell you parts after the warranty expires.

    To name a few:

    Proprietary connectors on the motherboard to the SATA
    drives (power and data). (Motherboard SATA pins that
    you have never seen before.)

    Front panels that can not be removed to insert things like
    powered front panel hubs and DVD drives.

    Proprietary power supplies with proprietary power connectors.

    Proprietary dimensions on motherboards (not ATX, ITX
    or anything recognizable).

    On the bright side, Lenovo's Think Stations are pretty
    reliable. Just hope they don't break.

    I have seen recommendations for Dell, but I have not had
    great experiences will Dell in the past, especially their
    habit of putting intermittent motherboards down the parts
    cleaner and reissuing them a spare parts.

    Anyone have a recommendation for a business grade
    computers that use generic parts and are very reliable?

    Many thanks,
    -T



    Not in any way an answer to your question - but -
    I wonder how anyone can sell new Lenovo desktops
    when the refurb units are ~ $ 200.

    I know - apples and oranges, but this unit is $ 230 _Canadian_

    https://www.infotechcomputers.ca/product/lenovo-thinkcentre-m710s-i7-16gb-desktop/

    I've bought 2 Lenovo laptops from these guys - they're legit.
    John T.

    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo. Chinese spyware. Do a search something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From T@21:1/5 to sticks on Sat Aug 30 03:00:10 2025
    On 8/29/25 7:00 PM, sticks wrote:
    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo.  Chinese spyware.  Do a search something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    That would apply to every computer sold today.
    They all have Chinese parts.

    And Lenovo is a multinational company with a lot of
    presence in the USA. Their tech support is USA based.

    The last two Lenovo's customers of mine bought
    were assembled in Mexico. They spend two days in
    customs. More than enough time to teach them our
    customs: blue jeans, hamburger, etc..

    What???

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From sticks@21:1/5 to All on Sat Aug 30 08:22:22 2025
    On 8/30/2025 5:00 AM, T wrote:
    On 8/29/25 7:00 PM, sticks wrote:
    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo.  Chinese spyware.  Do a search
    something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    That would apply to every computer sold today.
    They all have Chinese parts.

    I didn't say anything about parts. I said spyware.

    And Lenovo is a multinational company with a lot of
    presence in the USA.  Their tech support is USA based.

    Sure, I think they're the number one in sales in the world. If you look
    at pricing, they usually offer machines that seem just a little bit
    cheaper than it's competition. Brilliant.
    While they would not let us into China, we still allow them in the US.
    Of course they take advantage of that.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From T@21:1/5 to sticks on Sat Aug 30 07:51:28 2025
    On 8/30/25 6:22 AM, sticks wrote:
    On 8/30/2025 5:00 AM, T wrote:
    On 8/29/25 7:00 PM, sticks wrote:
    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo.  Chinese spyware.  Do a
    search something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in
    them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    That would apply to every computer sold today.
    They all have Chinese parts.

    I didn't say anything about parts.  I said spyware.

    And Lenovo is a multinational company with a lot of
    presence in the USA.  Their tech support is USA based.

    Sure, I think they're the number one in sales in the world.  If you look
    at pricing, they usually offer machines that seem just a little bit
    cheaper than it's competition.  Brilliant.
    While they would not let us into China, we still allow them in the US.
    Of course they take advantage of that.



    Oh no disagreement there. Mainland China are definitely
    bad actors.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From s|b@21:1/5 to sticks on Sat Aug 30 21:38:12 2025
    On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 21:00:09 -0500, sticks wrote:

    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo. Chinese spyware. Do a search something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    Because it's better to have American spyware. /s

    --
    s|b

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From T@21:1/5 to All on Sat Aug 30 23:43:23 2025
    On 8/30/25 12:38 PM, s|b wrote:
    On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 21:00:09 -0500, sticks wrote:

    I personally, would never buy a Lenovo. Chinese spyware. Do a search
    something like "do lenovo computers have chinese spyware in them."

    Not in my house, that's for sure.

    Because it's better to have American spyware. /s



    If you are speaking of the interminable junk manufactures
    like to add to Widows 10/11, you can get rid of it with
    adwcleaner:

    https://downloads.malwarebytes.com/file/adwcleaner


    https://search.brave.com/search?q=do+lenovo+computers+have+chinese+spyware+in+them%3Ddo+lenovo+computers+have+chinese+spyware+in+them&summary=1&conversation=299e4295318505c0e6b9c7


    Lenovo Spyware Concerns
    The question of whether Lenovo computers contain Chinese spyware is
    complex and involves historical incidents, corporate structure, and
    ongoing security concerns.

    Lenovo has a documented history of installing problematic software on
    its devices. In the past, the company was found to have pre-installed
    Superfish adware, which acted as spyware by performing man-in-the-middle attacks on encrypted web traffic to inject targeted advertisements,
    thereby compromising user security.
    This software could reinstall itself even after a clean OS
    reinstallation, and Lenovo paid fines to settle related charges with the Federal Trade Commission.
    More recently, security researchers have identified vulnerabilities in Lenovo's UEFI firmware that could allow malicious actors to gain
    persistent access to devices.

    While Lenovo is a Chinese company headquartered in Beijing, it is a
    publicly traded corporation with significant international operations, including headquarters in North Carolina, USA, and thousands of
    employees in the United States.
    The company has undergone multiple U.S. national security reviews
    (CFIUS) since acquiring IBM's PC business in 2005 and has been a trusted
    vendor to various U.S. government agencies.
    Lenovo denies any ties to the Chinese government or the People's
    Liberation Army, stating it operates independently and is not controlled
    by the Chinese Communist Party.
    Its primary shareholder, Legend Holdings, holds a 36% stake but
    controls only two of twelve board seats and has no operational control
    over the company.

    Concerns about Lenovo's devices stem partly from the Chinese
    government's legal requirement for companies to cooperate with
    intelligence services, which some interpret as a potential obligation to provide data to the state.
    However, the company maintains that it does not participate in or have
    links to Chinese state-run cyberespionage campaigns.
    Some U.S. lawmakers have raised concerns about potential espionage
    risks, leading to requests for the Navy Exchange to stop selling Lenovo products, though Lenovo denies these allegations as based on outdated or unsubstantiated claims.

    Despite these concerns, Lenovo's ThinkPad line, developed primarily in
    the USA, Japan, and Taiwan, is often considered more secure than other
    lines.
    The company also offers physical camera switches on many models for
    added privacy.
    For users with heightened security needs, recommendations include
    wiping the OS and reinstalling it from a trusted source, using Linux, or flashing the BIOS to remove potential firmware issues.

    In summary, while Lenovo has a history of security lapses involving pre-installed software, the company denies current ties to the Chinese government and operates under international corporate governance
    standards. The risk of spyware is not inherent to all Lenovo devices but
    is influenced by the specific model, firmware, and user practices.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)